A little background on the labs I teach, first. I teach weekly labs. For each lab, there is a page with 5-6 questions on it that they can do and turn in for up to 1 point of extra credit per sheet, which can raise their grade by a letter if they do the sheets for all the labs. They have to be turned in at the beginning of each lab for the student to receive credit. They know this. At the beginning of each lab, I tell them that anyone who is going to turn one in should do it at that time. We are giving midterms this week, covering seven labs. Usually the average midterm grade is about a 65, which is a D.

And guess what? I just got an email from one of my students, saying that she had the extra credit sheets from all the labs taught up to this point. She says that she "forgot" to turn them in and pretty please would I accept them. "Forgot," my ass. I bet $100 that she took the exam and realized that she's not doing very well. I told her that I would not accept them. I was honest with them at the beginning of the semester. I told them that the lab was not an "easy A" and that doing all the extra credit that is offered can really help their grades. Not my fault she didn't pay attention. Bet she'll turn in the extra credit sheets for the rest of the labs, though.:huytsao

I am currently writing my PhD dissertation and my specialization is post-secondary and adult education. The average grade of 65 (failing) is a bit worrisome. Perhaps the teaching methodology could be evaluated or the "dry" material could be better planned? When the "average" is failing, it's often a duel problem between teacher and learner.

As to late submissions and extra credit, I'm with Bitter. I give a written and verbal explanation of the course requirements. Unless there is a very valid excuse (MD note of an unplanned surgery/illness), I don't deviate from the course outline. Research shows that when you hold people to high standards, they either rise to the challenge or fail. If you set low standards, excellence is never realized.

When teachers make courses so difficult that the average is below passing, either the students don't belong there or the professor doesn't.

Marking on the curve has some merit, but is not a valid example for future employment.

BS = We all know what that is

MS = More of the Same

PHD = Piled Higher and Deeper

Just to be on the student's side...not every excuse is a lame excuse. The responses here seem so one sided, so I thought I would balance it out a little bit.

First of all, I am a non-trad accounting student at the University of Kansas. I am also a mother of four boys. My husband works full time and is also in the Army Reserves. I work part time performing audits for a local bank. I also am a "foster parent" for an adult man with developmental disabilities.

I am from a family where not one person has graduated college. Actually, I am not sure if anyone from my town has ever graduated college. I was a teenage mother. Noone had ever spoke with me as a teenager about going to college or how to do it. Not once. So, I chose a path that wasn't what was the best for me.

I was an honor student in school and was always ahead of myself because of self-education.

After I had children, I wanted nothing more that to receive a secondary education. I wanted to provide better for my children. I wanted my children to have a chance to see how important an education is.

So now, with about one semester left to get my Bachelor's. There is not one semester that "something" doesn't happen that causes me to miss a bunch of classes. Whether it is my children becoming ill while my husband has to be off on some military orders or obligations that arise from the disabled man that I take care of or whatever.

One semester, we had a horrible illness run through our home. Each of my children got it, but not all at once. It hit them one after the other, like a chain. Right after that, my husbands mother died. I had to miss an exam to attend her funeral. I was making a "C" in one of my most difficult classes. (I was a 4.0 student at the time) The instructor pulled me in his office to tell me how shitty I was doing at midterm. I tried to explain to him how my children had been ill and then how their grandmother had died. It was their first loss and it had been very trying at home.

Well, I sure didn't get the response I wanted. He told me that I was using my children as an excuse. He said that the other students had sports and clubs and that their responsibilities were just as tough as mine. That was obviously coming from someone that has never had children.

Anyway, my point is, sometimes people's lives do run away from them and things can get overwhelming. All I want to do is graduate and make up for any wrong directions I took when I was a kid.

I no longer tall instructors my issues because I feel like they do not care. I just do my best and if I can't make class, I just can't do it and no longer ask for exceptions. All this has got me is a GPA that went from 4.0 to 3.42 which is highly disappointing to me.

So, I do feel that people should not automatically assume that an excuse is "lame".

Different schools have different rules. Some universities have strict attendance rules, some do not care how many times you are absent as long as you pass your exams, and some leave it up to the individual professor.

I found that when I went to school, that in the engineering, science and math classes, they didn't care how often you missed class as long as you got your labs in, were there for all the exams and passed your final. But in the Liberal Arts classes, attendance was held against a student.

I agree that a person of you age, and situation could be given some latitude, especially when you are still at Dean's list GPA's even with the problems you face.

You are a credit to your family and I, if your professor would give you more leeway than a 20 year old who's biggest problem is which party to attend that weekend. Life is about judgment.

wow everyone is really rough on the students here. This is a lab for non-science majors so what is the huge deal with easing up a bit. None of these kids will be using that class for their future work so does it really make a differance if the grade is curved from a 65 to 75.

wow everyone is really rough on the students here. This is a lab for non-science majors so what is the huge deal with easing up a bit. None of these kids will be using that class for their future work so does it really make a differance if the grade is curved from a 65 to 75.

There is a thing about discipline: Either you learn it or it beats you (Rhetorical "you", of course).

I am currently writing my PhD dissertation and my specialization is post-secondary and adult education. The average grade of 65 (failing) is a bit worrisome. Perhaps the teaching methodology could be evaluated or the "dry" material could be better planned? When the "average" is failing, it's often a duel problem between teacher and learner.

A 65 isn't failing, but it is close. The way the grading is set up, it is a D. I personally think the entire lab is set up badly, but I'm not the one that designs the course. The major problem, though, is that the students just don't want to put the work in, generally. They think that just because they aren't biology majors, they shouldn't be required to know the material. A lot of them are just out of high school and they still have the high school mentality. They want to be spoon-fed the material and be able to get an easy A with very little work. The reality is that the lab wouldn't be very difficult if they would just put the effort in. I warned them repeatedly that the midterm would be difficult if they did not stay on top of the material. If they took it one lab at a time, and worked through the material as we went, they would have done very well. Unfortunately, if they wait to study, they wind up with a lot of material to memorize and very little time to do it in. I told them that I would answer any questions they had and that I would help them as much as possible. Surprise, surprise, no one came up to me or emailed me questions. To me, after giving them fair warning, it isn't my fault if they don't listen.

wow everyone is really rough on the students here. This is a lab for non-science majors so what is the huge deal with easing up a bit. None of these kids will be using that class for their future work so does it really make a differance if the grade is curved from a 65 to 75.

Like TOM said, you either know the material or you don't. So yes, it does matter, especially for the students who made the grade. I know that I, as a student myself, would be pissed if another student made the same grade I did, with less effort. To say that students who did the work for one grade should be curved an entire letter grade is absurd, in my opinion. I think that with a few exceptions (like the Chinese student I posted about earlier), you should get the grade you deserve and that you've done the work for. If you've done D-level work, you deserve a D.

Okay, I lied. I'm taking a late paper from a Black student who says he was in jail. He says that he was going 70 in a 45 mph zone and a cop pulled him over. The cop had a drug sniffing dog. He says that the cop asked him if he had any controlled substances. He swore he didn't, but he said the cop went back to the cop car and then back to the student's car and suddenly he had a controlled substance in his car. One learns not to believe student excuses, but this seemed creative and original. So he can turn his paper in late. I'm such a pushover.

Okay, I lied. I'm taking a late paper from a Black student who says he was in jail. He says that he was going 70 in a 45 mph zone and a cop pulled him over. The cop had a drug sniffing dog. He says that the cop asked him if he had any controlled substances. He swore he didn't, but he said the cop went back to the cop car and then back to the student's car and suddenly he had a controlled substance in his car. One learns not to believe student excuses, but this seemed creative and original. So he can turn his paper in late. I'm such a pushover.

Yeah, I sort of feel that if they can come up with an original excuse, I am more likely to let them make quizes up. I let one guy make up the final exam last semester because he seemed really sincere and was honest about the fact that he had just been an idiot (his words, by the way).

Yeah, I sort of feel that if they can come up with an original excuse, I am more likely to let them make quizes up. I let one guy make up the final exam last semester because he seemed really sincere and was honest about the fact that he had just been an idiot (his words, by the way).

I was allowed to take a midterm late during my sophomore year because I had a rash covering about half my body that caused me to spend about 3 hours a day taking showers trying to subdue the itch, plus I could not wear clothing without becoming so itchie that I scratched until I bled.

My thermodynamics professor gave me a makeup exam with one main question and he threw a trick into the question that no one would be able to answer because of a little gimmic, but I just happened to know the missing link, so to speak, that allowed me to get 100%. It was one basic question with a large group of subquestions based on the previous answers.

He was pissed off, because he wanted to use me as an example for not asking for or taking makeup exams.

I was allowed to take a midterm late during my sophomore year because I had a rash covering about half my body that caused me to spend about 3 hours a day taking showers trying to subdue the itch, plus I could not wear clothing without becoming so itchie that I scratched until I bled.

My thermodynamics professor gave me a makeup exam with one main question and he threw a trick into the question that no one would be able to answer because of a little gimmic, but I just happened to know the missing link, so to speak, that allowed me to get 100%. It was one basic question with a large group of subquestions based on the previous answers.

He was pissed off, because he wanted to use me as an example for not asking for or taking makeup exams.

Two things to say:

1. OUCH!

2. Good for you!

Laurend,

I soo dont blame you for being disappointed. And totally agree with your stance. As a biology major, I know how the non-major's looked at the bio class, "Its not my major, what do I care?"

Probably a good deal of clueless freshmen mixed in with upper classmen who dont care anymore and just want to graduate.

65 as an average is pretty good for a non-major class.

Its a D.

As a lab assistant when I was in college, I heard the stupidest excuses and graded the most horrible lab tests.

On a side note, while grading lab tests for my prof. for Zoology, the first question on the test was: "what is the scientific name for the domestic pig?" (and yes, they were told this question would be on the test)

Some of my more favorite answers:

Oinkus Barbeq-us

Big-un hog-un

and my personal all time favorite, Sus Scrotum

On a side note, while grading lab tests for my prof. for Zoology, the first question on the test was: "what is the scientific name for the domestic pig?" (and yes, they were told this question would be on the test)

Some of my more favorite answers:

Oinkus Barbeq-us

Big-un hog-un

and my personal all time favorite, Sus Scrotum

Oh geeze, you made me snort! Those sound familiar! The first semester I taught, I got pissed at one of my classes. I was giving easy multiple choice quizes, but they were doing very badly. I decided that if they wanted to fail, I'd really make them fail. I changed my quizes to fill-in-the-blank/short-answer. Definitely didn't make the grades go up, but it made me feel better. I eventually phased them out, though, because they were a bitch to grade. Every single person had a different answer and they were all mispelled. Our midterm and final exams are multiple choice, so they don't even have to actually know the answer, just be able to recognize it. And still the 65 average.

I hope this doesn't make too many enemies, but sometimes people are so smart/intelligent and maybe even disciplined that they do not realize how hard some things are for others who don't have their gifts.

When I was a senior in JHS (9th grade back then), I got the highest mark in the school on both the Math midterm and Science midterm, plus got a 98 on the Social Studies midterm. I only got an 85 on the English midterm (damn poetry). There were 34 classes in the 9th grade.

Well, about a week after the Midterms, my French teacher let me have it in class in front of all my classmates. He said that the teachers where at a meeting and they were all bragging about how well their students had done. Of course, my Science teacher, Math teacher and SS teacher all were bragging about me and then they asked Mr. Moody, how did TOM do on the French midterm? (If he wasn't a Black man, he would have turned red), but he said 36% and they laughed him out of the room.

Believe it or not, I studied harder and spent more time studying for the French midterm than any other midterm. I just do not have an aptitude for foreign language. Recent studies on the brain show that the brain is not like a computer.

When you load a spreadsheet on a PC, the same components are used as when you load a word processor or a financial program. However the brain has selected areas for different purposes. I have never been able to play a musical instrument, type without looking at the keyboard or learn a foreign language, but I can fix almost anything, ranked in the top 3% of the country on competitive math and verbal reasoning tests in high-school and scored very well on the SAT.

It seems that we all have our good points and bad points, so I hope that (you) teachers can show some compassion when dealing with people who have a low aptitude in your chosen field.

I hope this doesn't make too many enemies, but sometimes people are so smart/intelligent and maybe even disciplined that they do not realize how hard some things are for others who don't have their gifts.

I definitely understand that. I have absolutely no aptitude for math. I have never made a grade higher than a B in any math or math-related class, no matter how much studying I do. Getting a B in a math class is a cause for celebration for me. The last math class I took was experimental design last semester. It was basically an intensive statistics class, using completely different techniques than any of the other stats classes I've taken. The only reason I did as well as I did in that class (I got a was because I had taken a SAS (statistical computer software) programming class the semester before. At the end of the experimental design class, I could literally do only about 10% of the material by hand. I couldn't tell you what a lot of the symbols used in the equation meant and I couldn't go to the professor for help because I couldn't use the proper terminology. But what I could do was figure out how to input the problem into the SAS software with the proper programming and interpret the results. If I hadn't had that SAS programming class, I probably wouldn't have passed the experimental design class.

The thing with the labs I teach is that there is very little that the students actually have to know how to do. The majority is basic memorization. I think a lot of them get really stressed out by the idea that they will have to know all of this stuff that they have never learned before and will never have to know again, and they make it a lot more complicated than it actually is. I could understand if it was like a math class and they were learning complex equations and having to remember them, but the most complicated thing they had to do on the midterm is use a microscope to figure out which thread was in the middle of a pile. The rest was straight memorization. Heck, they didn't have to do that much, actually. They just have to be able to recognize the correct answer out of three or four choices, most of which are not at all similar. I also tried to teach them little tricks for memorizing the correct answers. For example, algae in the phylum Pyrrophyta cause red tides. "Pyro" is a word that many know is associated with fire. Fire is red. Therefore, they can associate Pyrrophyta with red tides. We try to use associations like that to make the memorization a little easier on them, instead of having them look at the organism through a microscope and recognize it soley by its appearance.