Wheetsin

As for compulsions - I have a big one in the sense of instant gratification. I demonstrate it most frequently with material objects. For example, if I decide that the living room needs new curtains, I will go out right then and hit every store I can think of looking for them. If I can't find what I want, I will come home and spend hours in the internet looking. If I still can't find it, right back out to different stores. I must have then right then, and they must be perfect. We will soon have the kitchen repainted, and I know what color curtains I want, but I don't want to buy them until it's actually painted -- in case the wall color looks differently than I'm picturing it. So I"ve already decided to wait on buying the curtains. It does't matter. I still get the twangs of compulsion that "I NEED to go find curtains" -- and then I have to remind myself, "Oh, no - I decided to wait..." Most people can think "I would like a lamp to go here, so next time I'm out I will look for one..." OCCASIONALLY I can do that, but most often it is a right-then trip to every store I can think of to find the lamp I'm after. In highschool I was like this about clothes. If I decided I wanted a black shirt, I had to have it right then. It didn't matter if I wasn't going to wear it for another week. One thing I can't stand is to have chapped lips. If my lips get chapped, I pull or bite off the dry pieces, causing more damage than if I just left them. So come winter, I always have some type of lip moisturizer with me. I'm not compulsive about putting it on, I usually forget to - but I will not be able to ignore any pieces of dry dkin on my lips so it's a preventative measure. Some that I've seen in others... A good friend of mine is - this will sound weird - compulsive about smelling herself. I'll try to describe it, I don't mean like lifting her arms to smell her pits or anything. It's all about her hands/arms. If she scratches her ear, she will smell her fingers immediately after. Scratches her head, same thing. If she's just sitting there, she will smell the back of her hand, or hold her forearm up to her nose. I used to think she was being really thoughtful because when she often holds her finger up to her nose like she's contemplating something, but you can actually hear her inhaling & exhaling - she's smelling. If she sits there with her head rested on her hand, she will then smell her hand where her head was resting. (This is odd, and good thing this is anonymous or she'd kill me - she has admitted to the same behavior with her crotch area - scratching/touchng her crotch for the sole purpose of being able to smell it on her hand afterward.) She says that the smells comfort her. Another co-worker of mine bites the inside of his mouth ALL the time. I'm trying to talk to him, and his mouth is contorting all over the place - looks almost like he's making faces at you. Sometimes you'll see him holding a tissue in his mouth, and he'll say that he pulled off a piece of skin and it was bleeding.

Probably looking at two different things here. Not being able to have a blank part of the page - totally separate, but doodling, drawing, clicking a pen, etc. while in a classroom setting, meeting, or any situation where you are receiving information inputs is actually demonstration of visual and/or kinesthetic learning. I do the exact same thing. I do not process information well if it's coming to me auditorily. To supplement that input type, I have to create a visual & kinesthetic stimulation. I was once asked to leave a professional conference because, during one of the lectures, the lecturer noticed that I was doodling and became offended that I was not paying attention to him. And it was a lecturer in the adult learning field -- of all people who should know better. (Teachers out there everywhere, when you see your kids doodling while you're talking, don't reprimand them for not paying attention -- chances are, this is what they have to do to process the information you're giving them.)

Doesn't sound like a PB to me. Water (especially being far enough out from your surgery that swelling should be a little down, and assuming yu haven't yet had a fill) should - for the most part - go right through. Especially just one swallow. I know that people have "chugged" more than their puches could hold, and for whatever reason the water wasn't going through, so it sort of backed up on them... but one swallow isn't going to do that. Maybe you just swallowed the wrong way? I dunno. You're the only one who knows what happened/how it felt. Generally speaking, PBs don't just happen. (It happens, but isn't the norm). There's discomfort and time involved.

This is kind of funny. When I researched my surgeon all of the reviews talked about what a hottie he was. Above and beyond his success rates, competency, etc. - they were talking about his looks. Like that's what I care about. When I saw him, I had to disagree with them. Didn't do anything for me at all. (I think he's the spitting image of Kevin McKidd). Someone I know who used him things he's a total dreamboat. I just can't see it. But I don't care. He did a fantastic job with my surgery, and the second surgery I went to him for, and that's what I care about.

Sometimes. And don't forget the psychological problems, which can be just as terrible to live with. And "live" is a stretch in some cases.

As for the questions: 1. Is it torture? I think it is. Someone's gonna have a heck of a time convincing me we aren't full into 2C. Even using the argument "they're told they won't be killed" - I would consider the instinctive and physical reaction to drowning or potential drowning enough to trump that. I've come pretty damn close to losing consciousness under Water, and have had moments when I've been underwater with no means of getting air, and farther up to swim than the air in my lungs would last and it doesn't matter what you "know" - the only thing that matters is what you're experiencing. 2. Should people in the US caught doing it be prosecuted as war criminals? Absolutely. 3. Would you support state-sanctioned torture of someone to save 1 person, 10 people, a thousand, a million people? This one I have to say depends. Depends on the context, what's at stake, etc.

For anyone out there who doesn't know (my husband didn't until very recently), waterboarding is a form of controlled drowning. Usually it's the subject strapped or chained to board that is either tilted downward (head at the lowest part), or includes a mechanism to tilt the head. Water is then poured over the face (bucket, hose, whatever), and the angle of the head and the duration the water is applied cause controlled drowning. Slight variations of the above, but that's the general principal (my husband thought it was a method of "Chinese water torture").

Her response was inappropraite and I would have escalated as well. It makes you wonder what she's perceiving that could give her that impression. I think that people used to being persecuted for <reason> (or hearing they will be, even if they haven't personally experienced it) either tend to assume that anything negative toward them is because of <reason>, or actually have a horrible self-fulfilling prophecy in that they will assume it's for <reason>. It doesn't have to be race. Look around here - we see a lot of "...because I'm fat" posts, even with things that aren't directly stemming from being fat. I say directly because many things could certainly be indirect - e.g. someone gets a chip on their shoulder, that changes their attitude toward others, others now react differently, others are now accused of acting differently because of <reason>. Twice I have had race used against me, and in opposite ways (one was for standing up for a group of black ppl, and one was being accused of racism). Pissed me off at the time, but looking back - how sad. One of the times, I managed a group that was probably 90% black, 5% Hispanic, 5% white. After more tardies, absences, numerous customer complaints, violations of the dress code, insubordination, etc. than I could excuse, I had to fire one of the black workers. It could just have easily been one of the white workers or one of the Hispanic workers, it just didn't work out that way. Our process included a meeting with HR, and when we met, he made the claim that I was firing him because he was black, I was racist, and was persecuting him because he was black. The HR lady asked him to substantiate this and he said "She hasn't fired any of the white people."

Not sure what left field that's coming from, but sarcasm really isn't needed. We can be adults. There's a huge difference between posting about an issue you (generically) are having, and proposing "this is what is going to happen with the band." A world of difference. I gurgle is much different from you will gurgle. I have never PBed is much different than you will never PB. Don't take it so personally that we disagree. We just have different perspectives on what's going on, that's all.

We seem to cross paths a lot today. :eek: I've been here a while, and I've seen a LOT of stories where bands didn't work out, people are having very hard times, people hating their decision, people not losing weight, erosions, slips, complacency, inability to change behaviors, etc. I see a lot more of that than I do "goody goody."

Ack forgive the misspells, bad grammar, etc. I don't want to wade through the tags to edit, and wasn't taking care as I typed. Is it Friday yet?

This may be an easier way to reply. I somewhat agree with you Wheetsin about addictive personalities but I dont agree that you can just move the addiction over to something else. I didn't mean you could just will yourself into a different addiction. It has to manifest, like any other addiction. I know i have an addictive personality. I used to smoke over 10 years ago and I did quit. I had quit about 4 years before my final time and I smoked 1 cigarette and I was a full time smoker again. Yes, but this is just your experience, and you can't use it to establish what's the case for anyone else (hence my initial response to you). My parents quit smoking... I'm going to guess 13 years ago. My mother doesn't smoke at all, my father has a cigar a few (maybe 3) times a year. Neither of them want nor have an impulsive irge to start smoking again. So there's one example of how your experience doesn't apply to everyone. (Instead, they're now both seriously overweight - definitely hopped on the food addictions). I think that what you are addicted to , you are addicted to. I dont know why a person who is not an overeater would have the band and if you were an overeater, how do you know that you would not be an overeater once you lost your band. People who are not overeaters have been banded to avoid becoming one, or for medical issues that weight would factor into. Jachut admittedly got her band for largely aesthetic reasons. A lady at my last employer was banded because obesity ran on her family, and she wanted it to be a preventative measure (she currently has no fill, but thinks of it as her insurance policy). All kinds of reasons out there. Im glad your band is working fine for you .My first band was working great for me. I lost 150 lbs in a year and a half. I had an erosion from my band and I had to have it replaced. While waiting for the new one to be restricted I gained almost 50 lbs back. I really thought I was past the addiction too. who knows Never said mine was working fine. :eek: I do understand what you're saying, I just think your pushing out what you personally have experienced as "the way it is" - possibly because you've not encountered that many other experiences. If I hadn't seen addiction hopping soooo many times, and in soooo many different ways, read the case studies, seen/heard the therapy sessions, etc. I might be resistant to the idea also, but for me personally -- too much evidence to think otherwise.

Find out if your state is a "one party" consent state. In these states, only one party has to give their consent to be filmed (there is also such a condition for audio recording). If your state is such a state, and your husband consents... There is some good base information here, but askings omeone who practices law in your state will be your best approach. CYA always. One-party consent seems to apply most of the time, otherwise we'd have a lot less undercover investigation, news reports, hidden camera evidence, etc. Parents have been able to submit unauthorized video of abusive nannies as court evidence, stores have submitted their security recordings for theft cases, etc.

Ah my eyes Te daughter did the right thing in filing a report and/or speaking with school officials. I understand parents get upset when their children are "messed with" - trust me, I don't have kids but I have young family. But knee jerk reactions to anything usually cause more harm than good, and people often wish they had just withheld a little longer. It's not like I told her "do nothing" - I just suggested less being less reactionary. That does not mean her daughter's safety will be at risk.

I didn't get that message from the responses you received. I think you'll find the majority of people here are overeaters, but you will also find that some were not. We have people here who were barely overweight. We have some who admit to normal portions, but all the wrong food choices combined with lethargic lifestyles. Etc. The comment of yours that I emphasized in my quote was specifically what I was addressing. We have I don't know how many members here... there are very, very few situations where you (generically) can say "this is what you will do" and have a chance at being accurate. Don't feel like "the only one." Regardless of what your situation is, there's probably someone else who shares it with you. Especially when your situation is overeating on a messageboard for fat and formerly fat folks. :eek:

I think someone who is an overeater because of an addictive personality will probably always be addicted to something. I disagree with "once an overeater always an overeater." By that rationale, it would be "once a smoker, always a smoker" and most of us know cases where that's not true. However, what is accurate is "once an addict, alawys an addict" - at least the VAST majority of the time (and to move beyond it takes a LOT... you probably don't know anyone who has done it, it happens that infrequently). I don't think that an addict of X type has to stay an addict of X type, I think they can fairly easily become addicts of Y or Z , A or M types. Usually referred to as addiction hopping or addiction swapping. A few examples of what I mean: A chain smoker stops smoking and gains 100 lbs because instead of being actively addicted to nicotene, they're now addicted to food and even the urge to have the sensation of something in their hands/mouths is quelled by food. A drug addict "finds Jesus" and kicks the drug habit, only to spend their every waking moment living in their religion. A person addicted to food loses the weight by becoming addictred to exercise, and/or obsession with weightloss. Instead of eating 6000 calories a day, they're now working out 6 hours a day. IMO, if you can't truly beat the addiction, your success is in "what" the addiction hops to and how well it can be maintained. A smoker who swaps to food can maintain that addiction more realistically than an overeater who switches to exercise. Someone who swaps to obsessive weightloss will not be able to maintain as long, or without severe consequences, as someone who becomes a compulsive cleaner. Realistically, how long can your average person maintain a routine of 6 hours exercise per day... vs. how long could someone maintain a pattern of overeating? (BTW - mental addiction, physical addicition - very different things, but what overeating falls into -- different thread). :eek:

I don't have children, let alone high school age, but my advice would be - don't be so reactive. Maybe something comes out of this, and maybe nothing does. She acted correctly in getting "her side of the story" filed after the incident was over - a very good practice IMO. Hmm, I know who he is. The only way I've ever heard the term used was as a very rude racial slur against blacks. Here's what Urban Dictionary says (posting only the ones that might be relevant): 1. (Apparently an alter-ego to redneck, and received the most votes) 2. 3. 4.

I will add, my specifc problem area is my hips/saddlebags and upper thighs. My stomach is still big, but it's very droopy.

losingjusme, I could have written that. I don't really consider myself near goal, I still have between 40 and 70 lbs to lose, depending on which guideline I look at. But... ...in tops I'm a mix of 14/16 (sometimes perfect, sometimes snug) and 18/20 (sometimes perfect, sometimes too big). On bottoms... crikey. Usually a 20 or 22. I don't know how the new LB sizing converts to standard, but in their new jeans I can get a 2 on but that's about it. 3 fits nicely. (1 pair of sz 2 fit, but all I've tried since have been really tight). Woohoo, in pictures from the waist up, I almost look normal!! :heh:

You know, I'm not sure. Pretty sure I was still doing it at a year out, but maybe only when something was stuck. Rarely do it anymore.

Yep, runny nose is a very common soft stop. Be glad you have it, it should have make life a little bit easier.

(Emphasis mine). This may be your very valid experience, but it is very innacurate to state it as a blanket fact. Many, many people here who are post-op are not overeaters, nor do they have to battle the will to overeat. IF (not everyone does) you have that good ol' addictive personality, then chances are you're still going (probably) to need to satiate that, but food will not necessarily be the answer any longer. I'm surprised you didn't come across this in your research or education. The idea that "the band doesn't work on the head" is something my surgeon's office virtually spewed out - hence their stringent requirements with a psychologist. I hope would most programs make an effort to teach this, but it's sad if they don't. It's also something you'll find everywhere in guidelines, rules to live by, etc. (referring mostly to messageboards, blogs, anecdotal experiences, etc.)

It's not offensive (IMO), it's good politicking. There is a very valid phenomenon that happens when Oprah is involved. It has been nicknamed "The Oprah Boost." It happens with music, clothing, books in particular, and even politics. When Oprah endorses it, even implicitly, its popularity goes up - whatever it of the week may be. Even Bush. It is sad that people flock behind a celebrity, but it happens. I don't find it offensive because it's our media imposed human nature. It's really no different from the use of celebrities in commercials. It's all about manipulation, and the fact that by and large, we allow ourselves to be manipulated. Celebrity involvement - provided the right celebrity - usually equates to success, whether success is money, popularity, advertisement - whatever. Look at what the Pepsi commercials of the 80s did for a virtually dead company. They brought celebrities into their commercials, that was the only thing they did differently, and relatively overnight they went from borderlining financial ruin to the #1 cola product. Also consider the demographic Obama is after, and the demographic that makes up a large percentage of Oprah's target audience. It's a smart move on his behalf.

Gurgling is extremely common. I'ev heard different theories on what, exactly, it is - but generally it comes with restriction. Not as a rule though. It does seem to dissipate over time. When I was first pre-op, my co-workers would look at me and think I had burped.

A strong sense of humor. Beyond anything else, this is - to me - the key sign of intelligence and wit. Honesty, openess, being direct. To me, that's very close to being trustworthy. People who are competent. People who put forth effort to better themselves. People who are not afraid to march to the beat of their own drum.