gadgetlady

Ahhh, laurend, those were the days I was just thinking about that thread, which started off denouncing people who weren't in favor of embryonic stem cell research, as being insensitive to those with disease and of course as also being anti-scientific. The reason I was thinking about it was because another lap-bander sent me a link to this article: The End of the Stem-Cell Wars - Yahoo! News . Fascinating reading. Anywho, one day maybe we'll both have time to get back to the evolution theory / creation theory debate with each other, laurend. In the interim, I would propose that to every answer there is an equal and opposite answer on the other side. Institute for Creation Research - A Christ-Focused Creation Ministry and Answers in Genesis - Creation, Evolution, Christian Apologetics provide insight into the other side.

"Telephone", as we called it, is a fun game, but doesn't correspond to how the Biblical text was written and has been duplicated over thousands of years. The link I provided above is an easy read and quite informative.

Here's a great article about Biblical accuracy. I strongly recommend reading it fully. Stand to Reason: Is the New Testament Text Reliable?

I had an employee once who was a phone "psychic" in the evenings. I asked her what the job entailed. She said, "I get phone calls, I listen to them, and I tell them what they want to hear." She neither had nor claimed to have any particular power or insight. I believe the industry is a fraud.

I should clarify. I started training them with these methods at 6 months. They either weren't able to physically master the methods until about 8 months.

When a child hits another child, it is in anger. Controlled spanking is not an angry, flailing, yelling, screaming, out of control response. Children can see the difference, even if some adults can't. Disciplinary spanking as a training method is not out of control and it is not a lazy response. It involves not only the spanking itself, but also discussions and explanations before and after of proper behavior. I completely agree that children who wail on their children are wrong. They are not teaching, but reacting -- doing so in an out-of-control manner. Abuse is, and should be, illegal. Controlled, disciplinary spanking is not abuse.

Baloney. My kids could process the connection between one action and another at about 6 months. That's when I taught them sign language, to sign "please" and "thank you" and all sorts of other things. They processed connections quite fine, thankyouverymuch. They were quite capable of learning that an action can lead to a consequence even at that young age -- to get out of your high chair requires your signing "down" and then "please".

And people say the media aren't biased. Give me a break!

That must have been very confusing and difficult for you. I was raised in a staunchly Catholic household, to the point where I even went to a Catholic university. But the Catholic faith held little for me, and I found myself after my years in college falling away from the church completely. It wasn't until I found a group of (non-denominational) Christians that I finally found my home as a Protestant, born-again believer. One of the things that really drew me to the church that I became a Christian in was the pastor's constant preaching that being a Christian didn't mean we checked our brains at the door. What I discovered after studying and researching the Bible is that there is a tremendous amount of evidence for the faith I have. Many will claim that truth and evidence contradict faith, but that's just not the case. The prophesies of Jesus in the Old Testament are numerous and surprisingly accurate. Now one can choose to believe in Jesus wholly as a matter of faith with no investigation of Scriptural backup, but when one does investigate and finds that Scriptural backup, the Bible just comes more alive. I'm going to give you a few of my favorite web links for you to investigate on your own. Some of them are former athiests and non-believers who, once they hunkered down and studied that which they were challenging, became Christians. Others provide some answers to the questions you've asked about creation and other doctrinal issues. LeeStrobel.com - Resource for Apologetics Videos with Lee Strobel Christian Answers Network (ChristianAnswers.Net): Multilingual answers, reviews, ministry resources, and more! [Home] Stand to Reason: Equipping Christian Ambassadors in the Areas of Knowledge, Wisdom & Character Answers in Genesis - Creation, Evolution, Christian Apologetics These are all great resources and there are many more. I would also be happy to answer any questions you might have about any issue involving Christianity, either on this board, by PM, or via personal email or phone. The best advice I can give you is to find credible sources of information on the issues and study, study, study. Forego adhering to the opinion that if you semi-believe, you're buying insurance against a crisis in the afterlife (if the Bible is true, what matters is what you believe in your heart, not what you call yourself). Ask questions and seek answers. Blessings to you; you will be in my prayers.

YOU have a fireplace and it has a screen. This particular situation was a rented condo in the 80's. There was a flimsy hanging grate which wouldn't have protected her from anything, much less the issue that she could burn herself on the metal itself. The toddler wasn't me, and the circumstances by which I learned that fire is hot were different. Every situation is different and requires a different response.

They didn't have one. And even if they did, as soon as she got out she would have headed back for the fire. The playpen wouldn't have taught her the very important lesson that fire = pain. Again, their choice to parent that way -- and yours as well. My choice to parent differently. Out of control wailing on your kids is violent. Controlled, calm spanking doesn't have to be. Many people have never experienced or seen controlled and calm discipline and therefore base their opinions on behaviors they've witnessed or experienced or seen on television. The discipline we use in our family is not violent.

BTW, I am not opposed to their choice of how to discipline . . . er, not discipline . . . their child. I just saw what they chose to do and saw that it didn't work. I also know what DID work with my own kids and am satisfied with the choices I made during that time in my kids' lives.

Yes. A quick swat to the hand or bottom would have been sufficient. She was old enough to understand that actions have consequences. IMO it was foolhardy to NOT properly train her that crawling into a fire can be painful. If I were her parent, I would not have wanted her to learn that consequence by another manner (i.e. getting burnt).

It's a big assumption that the only reason children disobey is because their parents are too busy, but be that as it may, the point of the spanking in my example is not punishment. It is training. It is associating a dangerous behavior with a memorable consequence so the child doesn't undertake the dangerous behavior again. In this example it is used when a child is too young to understand the inherent danger of an action -- e.g. touching a hot stove. When I was a teenager I watched my brother and sister-in-law try to train their daughter not to crawl towards a blazing fireplace (we were on a family vacation together). My niece was fascinated by the fire and kept going back there. They didn't believe in punishing or spanking, only "redirecting". They spent their evening trying to distract her from the fireplace, picking her up and moving her away from the fireplace time after time for hours on end. Whatever toy they placed in front of her didn't hold the same appeal as the flickering fireplace. One quick swat to the bottom would have done the trick in about 3 minutes, rather than hours of "redirecting" that never worked. The next night, she was back at the fire. Once they realized they had lost the battle, the rest of us were informed that we couldn't light the fire for the rest of the vacation.

Well, I don't know what hasn't been answered, but I have to go live my life now! I'm hopping aboard the ship again and probably won't have any internet access for a long while. I'd be happy to answer any questions when I get back. I think if you review this thread in detail you will see that there's nothing on this issue that I'm afraid of addressing. Best to all!

You're such a pleasant person. I imagine you're a friend magnet.

That's your decision. I don't answer potentially loaded or controversial questions without knowing what I'm answering. If someone asks me a question that begs explanation, I ask for the explanation first. If you asked me about someone dying for another's sins, I would need context, and, of course, how sin is defined.

Oh, sorry. I didn't know the rules you had set up for this game. Next time I'll make sure I abide by them because I wouldn't want to say anything to offend you. So: by your rules: if you had presented me with that scenario and I didn't know in advance that the doctor was a mass murderer, I probably would have asked more questions before answering the question. Numbers 4, 5, 6, and 7 would have been a tip-off that more information was needed.

Boy, I sure wish I had time to be here today! I barely have time to read, much less post, on the free wi-fi I found on land today. Think about all Hitler and Stalin did to rise to power. Weren't they courageous??? To get all that power in the face of those trying to depose and fight them? No, he is not courageous. He is evil. I do not ever applaud the efforts of mass murderers, regardless of how innovative they are.

Just poking my nose in here, catching up on the day . . . would love to help you, L8BloomR and StephC, but I'm on a cruise right now and have better things to do -- besides, clearly you don't need me {grin}. StephC, love your sentiments. Green and Devana, incredible stories about "other" religions -- some people are so short-sighted! I can just see you chuckling as you remember -- I laughed, too. As to questions of abortionists doing it for the money, I believe this factor is one of many. If you listen to former abortionists who are now pro-life, they do cite the money as having been a big factor for them. I can provide a link to substantiate if anyone wants it -- when I get back from the cruise :-)

Yeah, cuz it's courageous to abort a full-term bay. Well, either that or unconscionable.

Absolutely. Spanking didn't work for your mother when you were a child. Maybe if she had done something differently it might have. Maybe it never would have. I can tell you unequivocally that in my family, it works. I can't argue with your mother's results; you can't argue with mine. Everybody's different. There is nothing wrong with your choosing not to spank. It's your decision. There is nothing wrong with my choosing to do so. There is, however, something very wrong with the government telling me I can't.

I disagree. I believe spanking in anger is cruel, spanking without first warning the child that that particular behavior will lead to a spanking is cruel, and spanking with gross force is cruel. But IMO there are ways to spank that don't fall into the "cruel" category by any stretch of the imagination. You are entitled to not spank your kids. But I am equally entitled to spank mine so long as I am not abusing them.

LOL again! As parents, we force our wills on our children in innumerable ways -- not to control them, but to train them and make them better people. As a parent, it is your JOB to train your children to understand right from wrong, and that there are consequences for bad behavior. You have acknowledged, by getting banded, that pain is a motivator for you. Why would it not be a motivator for your kids? I'm not advocating whacking your kids around daily if they don't behave like robots. I'm simply saying that for some parents and some kids, the fear of a painful swat is the only thing that will motivate that particular child to relearn bad behaviors.

LOL! Isn't that what the band is doing for you (I'm assuming you're already banded)? Don't you find that the pain of overeating and PB'ing assists you in retraining your body not to do that which is unhealthy for you?