Dune

Thanks Cocoabean, i am thinking that i should have perhaps included a link to the thread i was referring to in my original post so that you guys would have known what i was referring to. I've stuck it in my reply to humming bird, have you been to it? Its a real long running thread, and interesting to see so many descriptions of a pain caused by virtually the same thing separating the temporary post op from the long term one of course. I worry because 5 years ago i dislocated my left shoulder which stretched my brachial plexus ball of nerves and left me paralysed down my left side shoulder to fingertips for 6 months. So this is a vulnerable area for me and i worry that this might mean that i might be one of the ones that experiences it more severely. It would all be worth it if it goes away in the end though, hense why i started this thread Thanks for your reply, Dune

Gosh, i am so sorry i have come across in this way. I did not mean to offend. I do not want to come across as arrogant and do not believe myself or make any claim to be any more important or knowledgeable than anyone else, infact, i often feel quite the opposite. When i said: "We know from the other thread that it is a common occurrence, and that the less ignorant doctors and consultants advise that it is caused by trapped air trying to leave the body and swinging the arms upwards can help with this." I was summing up, some what clumsily what i had gotten from this thread here: http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f78/left-shoulder-pain-36357/ in the complications area. I was not stating it to be fact. Although, the amount of posts in the other thread (provided link) indicates that it is a common occurrence, hense why i said "We know from the other thread that it is a common occurrence". And, if you check the link (if you havnt seen this thread already) you will also see that in the thread, there are many stories of people whos doctors and/or consultants have not payed a blind bit of notice or acknowledgment to the shoulder pain, or did not give them any warning about the problem before the op, despite the fact that so many people seem to get it. These are what i would call the "ignorant" doctors, and it is upon this scale that i chose to qualify the "less ignorant" doctors, regarding the posts in the same thread where people spoke about doctors and consultants who acknowledged the problem and gave this advice about it. If you reread, i have not said that this is correct or that swinging the arms is a cure. It does seem like a bit of a lollipop solution in some of the severer descriptions people have given really, but, never the less, i simply stated that this is the advice that some people in this thread said that they were given by doctors, i did not support or advocate it. More than this, the message your post has given to me is that there are different types of pain with different causes, some more severe than others. I am really sorry about this and for the discomfort you have experienced with yours, i really did not mean to offend you. The purpose of my thread was to find out if it does go away and what works/helps with this. As i say, your answer indicates that sometimes it does not, but i was also hoping for some stories of people who had it bad like you who it did leave eventually, to perhaps give some encouragement. Love Dune.

The posts here have got me thinking about the whole moral issue of telling the truth and telling lies. In modern culture from birth we are given mixed messages (you MUST tell the truth at all times, or Santa wont be coming down the chimney this year to give you lots of presents lol) which is why some of us, when we contemplate these situations in any sphere of our lives are not sure what we should do. A microscope that only shows things 50x (I dont have a big appetite, I am a picky eater or some foods make me feel sick) is just as accurate as a microscope that shows things at 100x (I used to be obese and had a gastric band fitted to help me to lose weight so now when i eat yada yada yada) they are just showing things at different magnifications. Again, sometimes, when you look at something magnified 100x you are less likely to know what it is you are looking at than when you are looking at things focused 50x, sometimes giving too much detail can create confusion rather than clarity. So, there would be nothing dishonest about not mentioning it. Infact, i do not see why you ever need to tell anyone if you didnt want to, unless somehow not knowing put them at risk/affected your relationship or you were in some sort of risk or needed their support. Loving my microscope analogy, if i achieve nothing else in life i have this hahahahaha :rolleyes2: Dune.

Hi, i just found this: Effectiveness and Safety Study of LAP-BAND Treatment in Subjects With BMI >/= 30 kg/m2 and < 40 kg/m2 - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov Its a study looking into the outcomes of BMI 30 banders. It hasnt finished yet, however, if you select the tabular view and then scroll down and select the link next to "change history" there is a list of trial study kind of stuff. Its all a bit basic, but from what i understood, it said that BMI 30 banders can lose a minimum of 30% of their excess weight in the first year. Might be worth coming back to in 2012 when the study finishes. Hope this helps, Dune

Thanks Cocoabean, i am starting to get a good picture here. I think things would change a bit, but perhaps not enough for it to be the trauma that originally worried it might be. Definitely something i would need to say goodbye to doing in exactly the same way as i used to. Its a definite no for bypass, no matter what, much too permanent and inflexible, dont like to do anything that i can not undo :rolleyes2: Many thanks, Dune.

Yes yes, i see where you are coming from. Hmm, but it is not that i am thinking that i should pray to lose weight as oppose to getting a LAP-BAND®®®. Perhaps even the opposite, worship is about the way you live, not just about prayer. I am concerned that my desire to lose weight stems from my humanly ignorance and it is the humanly ignorance i should be seeking to treat rather than the weight. Once you eliminate ignorance, then all else follows. In an extreme sense, i know in my heart that this is true, but i know that i am not in a place on my spiritual journey to truely act upon this, which is what concerns me. With this being so, would i be going further into ignorance by treating the effect rather than focusing upon the cause? (ignorance and desirous distraction - food cravings, wanting to look nice - from what is Holy and Good whatever you conceive this to be God or no God). But as Cheri and Mariasha support, treating an effect might help to strengthen me to be able to focus better on the other things i want to achieve. But then as i said in my original post, while this is a very genuine point in itself, is it genuine in my situation? Am i kidding myself? I just dont know, its something i need to think about, and any posts people write will help me with this and are much appreciated, as are yours, many thanks, Dune.

Thanks Cocoabean, its really encouraging the amount of replys there are saying that it hasnt changed things too drastically water wise. When you say you can drink water as quickly as you ever could, what does the ever could stand for, were you much of a conscious water guzzler before you had the op? or just a normal "drink water when thirsty" kind of person? Your definitely right about the trade off point, and everyone's answers here are much appreciated in the information they are giving me to help decide what to do. Many thanks, Dune

Glad to see there are others like me, its great isnt it! You drink even more water? wow, thats very cool, do you think the band might have something to do with this? Annoying about the chug a lugging, thats something that i would miss, there is nothing like the feeling of satisfaction, completion, energy and hydration that you get from sculling a nice 1.5 litre bottle of Buxton (or whatever your preference). Thanks AngryBaby, btw, i love your screen name. Dune.

Thankyou so much for sharing this Cheri, i feel less alone hearing a little about your difficulties, though different from my own, its nice to know that i am not the only one. What you are saying is right, if i got the LAP-BAND®, i would be taking care of my body, and as Mariasha said there is no reason why it should contradict my efforts to please God. Infact, this reminds me of an advert i saw on a church billboard i walked past once. It had a picture of a wrinkled puppy on it and it said "offer your worries to God". I have never forgotten it since, it made me think of brother Lawrance, a French monk i think, who constantly dedicated everything he did, even the washing up as an offering to God. I might have to reread his book as a reminder; and, I can offer my desire to be banded to God and dedicate the whole procedure if i were to go through with it to Him. I would have never of thought of this if it werent for you, thanks! ...mysterious ways aye :rolleyes2: Dune.

Wow, Mariasha thankyou for this encouraging post. What you have said here has really reassured me, you are quite right! Many thanks, Dune

wow thanks Jachut this is really encouraging. You mentioned that if you did have a packet of biscuits you would not be able to have dinner, is this because you dont feel hungry naturally, or the band physically restricts you? Did you take up running as a result of losing the weight? Was it difficult to get into or did it just happen? What is Band plus behaviour modification, is this a term for a natural process or a treatment offered to go with the procedure? Again, thankyou for your straight and honest answer. Its also reassuring to hear that if we get stressed we might still be able to have the odd comfort food...occasionally of course :rolleyes2: Dune

WOW THANK YOU AMAZING, JUST WHAT I NEEDED TO HEAR!!! :rolleyes2: So, you do not feel any discomfort when you are drinking water if you have had over a certain amount? sorry, just wanting to clarify. Many thanks, Dune

I am sorry L12 i dont want to confuse you, i seem to have that affect on people :rolleyes2: I should have quoted you, i was referring to what you were saying about when you have been running... But wow a Gallon, thats about 4 litres isnt it, that is excellent stuff, very relieving, i think i might be able to live with 4 having 4 litres a day. Thats very reassuring thanks. With the band then, do you physically feel that you can not fit as much Water in, in the same way that you physically feel that you can not fit as much food in. Could too much water cause you to convulse? Many thanks, Dune

Well i like to think we are all welcome in which ever forum fits, and while different forums have different specifications, some topics, like this one sit in-between the lines. Who is to say that if i were to post in the post-op forum some one would not come along and complain that i was posting in the wrong place there due to me being a pre op simply wanting information to inform my decision as to whether or not to have the surgery. I am sure post ops are perfectly welcome to give advice and support in the pre op forum. Infact, i think advice from the post ops in many of the pre op queries is very helpful. However, there is sense to what you are saying and i appreciate direction, if i do not receive any replies here, i shall re-post the same thread in the post op forum. Regards, D

But i am pre op. I thought this forum was for pre op's who wanted to know stuff about the surgery :thumbup: ...that's what the forum title implies.

Thanks for this Cheri, this is fairly reassuring, maybe i will have to have less, but, maybe not drastically so. Its hard though, that 1.5 - 2 litres in the morning really changes my day for the better. Weight loss is one thing, but efficient toxin elimination, especially as i get older just feels like something that i shouldnt compromise, happy to change the unhealthy part of my diet but are the healthy parts worth compromising. I guess there are identity issues here as well, its something that makes me me, i am known in my area for being the girl that always carries around a bottle of water wherever i go, but i do this because it makes me feel great, its a very underestimated commodity. *sighs* whats to do? :thumbup: Many thanks, Dune

it really is *nods* Thanks for this L12, most helpful. When you said that you cant chug it though sometimes you would love to, did you mean that you cant because the lap band prevents you from being able to take in a large amount of Fluid, or is this just something you were unable to do anyway? Its very reassuring to see that you are still able to do physical activities without being fully hydrated, although this could be a concern for me. How long ago did you have it done? Have you found that you can consume more fluid as time has gone on? Many thanks, Dune

Hello everyone, I am a worshiper of Water. The first thing i do when i start the day is guzzle down 1.5 litres. It makes me feel great! and is one of things that has kept me going in,life when everything else is out of control. Some people go on about the "too much water" moral panic, which while having some truth in the extreme, after much research i have discovered that allocated amounts of healthy water consumption is largely relative to our lifestyle and bodies functioning. Anyway, after speaking with a lapband consultant, i have discovered that if i were to go through with surgery, i would no longer be able to have my water guzzling session in the morning. Which has really given me something to chew on in my decision making, because this ritual has benefited me so much over the years. I am wanting to know if i would ever be able to drink large amounts of water again. Does anyone know? I questioned the possibility that after a couple of years of the surgery, i might get to a stage where ,my size, eating habits and diet might have gotten to a stage where i could do things like this without the band (on a technical level) preventing me in any way. I am hoping that someone on here might have some answers to this. The consultant said (in a sort of automated way, lovely, intelligent, enthusiastic and attentive though she is) that it might be that i wont want to have that amount of water once the band is in place etc. But this is missing the point. I do not see that as a good thing, as water is very important for giving your body energy and eliminating toxins, i am not sure that i would be able to tolerate sacrificing my healthy 1.5 litre start to the day for the lapband and would appreciate any comments or solutions people have to offer with regard to this. Many thanks, Love Dune.

Hello, i am considering having a lapband fitted but would like some feedback to inform my decision making from some veteran lapbanders, i would regard these to be people who have had a LAP-BAND® for 5 years or more. How long have you had your band? Have there been any problems with your band? What problems and why, and how was it fixed? What efforts were required on your part? I am particularly interested in people who suffer from binge eating disorders, how have you coped when you have been finding things difficult. Have you relapsed and had a "to hell with the band i'm having cheesecake!" or does the band make this impossible. Have any of you been in situations where it has gradually stretched caused by and/or leading to a relapse? I would really like to hear from people who have been banded for 5 years or more to help me to gauge whether or not this is a long term solution. It is common to hear stories of success for up to 2/3 years, but you never know whats going to hit you in life, and so i would really appreciate some veteran feedback both positive and negative. Many thanks, Love Dune.

Hi everyone, i have deep religious love for every true conception of God, and am a practicing Christian of sorts, i follow Jesus' teachings, but have a firm commitment towards the study and apprehension of all religious mysticism. The reason i am sharing this to start with is so that you can understand where i am coming from and going to with my dilemma. As i am sure many of you were and are, i am so tired of struggling with my weight. I just want to get on with my life, move further, get beyond the emotionally, mentally and spiritually circular yo yo of fat and thin. However, the mystical perspective of this would be that the weight issue is just an effect of the underlying cause. Most mystics (Christian and all others too) would exclaim that the underlying cause is that we are unable to detach from our desires, we are not poor enough in spirit and pure enough in heart. And, if we were to detach from all of our desires and dedicate our lives upon focusing upon the light of Christ within, then we could become close to God and be delivered from all worldly sorrow (which in this context, would include our concern about our health, weight and the way we look). So, the mystical answer is to pray constantly and focus on God, haha, easier said than done aye! The most dedicated of mystics went through great pains and sorrows through their dedicated Quest to become close to God, so i dont want you to think i am being self righteous, i myself have a lot of deep angst and issues in my own quest to become close to God and have a very long way to go yet. With what i said about coming close to God in mind, i am wondering if, if i were to get a LAP-BAND®®, would this be vain, desirous and self serving? I am aware that if i were to go ahead with it, using rational arguments you could say that by doing it, i would be embarking on a journey, that would essentially treat an effect (the weight and all the other problems that go with it) that would create space to focus on the cause, move on from the weight issue to become a better person and Glorify God in all that comes from this. However, is this just a ruse to satisfy my vanity? Am i kidding myself? I cant help wondering if my difficulties with my weight are a challenge that i have been given as an opportunity to practice my faith. Are all difficulties not opportunities given to us to practice our faith? How would i be practicing my faith if i got the LAP-BAND®® surgery? Then there is the cost. I live in the UK, and my weight currently is not heavy enough for me to be eligible for help. If i wanted to do this i would need to get a loan. One could argue "hey why not, its what everyone does" and, i would be able to afford the payments. However, together with my concerns about whether or not it would be right spiritually, i worry that the funding would also be out of sync spiritually. We are taught by the bible that we must be blameless by (amongst other things) keeping our finances in order. So, what are your thoughts about my dilemma? Can you share with me some of the moral and spiritual dilemmas you have faced with the LAP-BAND®® surgery and whether or not you have resolved them, and if you did, what was the process? Some of you might tell me that i should get some spiritual council from someone in my church congregation, however, as i am sure you will understand, most people outside of our desperate problems do not understand and in defense of this would argue for us not to do it without consideration. I should, do and shall continue to pray for guidance, but i also hope that there maybe some people here that might offer me some advise and support. Many thanks, Love Dune.

Hello, i have just read the thread about left shoulder pain and found everyone's experiences really interesting to read. I want this thread to be dedicated specifically to stories of people who had left shoulder pain but no longer have it, with a description of how long it took for it to go away, how it felt through stages of its leaving and if there was anything that specifically helped it to leave. We know from the other thread that it is a common occurrence, and that the less ignorant doctors and consultants advise that it is caused by trapped air trying to leave the body and swinging the arms upwards can help with this. Posts reiterating this information are helpful and encouraging, but i would really prefer to hear specifically from people who had the shoulder pain, but no longer have it. Many thanks, Love Dune.