NaNa

And congrats on your new surgery! I am very happy that you responded in an articulate way, GOOD FOR YOU, follow your surgeons rules, if he sees a problem with it long term, then your surgeon can address it. The point of my post was to poll people and ask them if they were following one of the new rules, everyone does not use that rule...Heck I did not use it when I first got banded, I followed the 30/30 rule with my first band for many years....did it cause my esophagus to become horribly dilated? NO..... However, I did not keep my lap band horribly too tight, nor did not vomit often either, so NOTHING is set in stone, however O'Brien's point was he did not see an advantage to not drinking while eating and some people developed esophageal dilation over time, it does not mean everyone will... Will I follow this new eating rule? Maybe I will do it sometimes, but not all the time...NO one ever asked me this question out 100 replies to that post..LOL But the new O'Brien's not waiting to drink has made me MORE more comfortable in drinking while I eat especially when I go out to restaurants with hubby and I will no longer feel guilty by drinking while eating...

To answer another point you made... I did not imply that JennyBean was "smart" because she agreed with me, I implied that JennyBean was "smart" and wise by going into her Lap Band journey with her eyes open and LEARNING, and hearing what 'others' like O'Brien has to say about the new no longer waiting to drink rule. She did not say she was agreeing with me, I don't expect EVERYONE to agree with me, I mentioned that in my post everything I say is not GOSPEL, I advised people to take what helps them and discard the rest. There is nothing about my post that insinuates that I am arrogant or a "know it all". Have I learned many things going on 9 years with my lap band? SURE, I've done my homework, read MANY studies, good and bad, seen MANY with complications and how they happened...SO if I am "wiser" from all of this ...I guess you can call me a "know it all".

First of all, I don't "venture" over to the Sleeve side because I have no interest in it, nothing against you or anyone else with the Sleeve, I just don't. I come here ONLY for lap band support and supporting lap banders and not to stir up trouble. Secondly, I have NOTHING to apologize for or "own" because I was just asking a simple Poll if anyone has adopted the New no longer waiting to drink while eating, which is now used by the MOST experienced lap band surgeon in the world that so many US lap banders follow the safety GREEN ZONE chart. You are a Sleever and you have nothing to do with this and you have a different anatomy, so this should not be applicable to you regarding O'Brien drinking updated rule. Please stay out the Bees' nest if you don't want to get stung....

*Whatever*.....please go play along with your fellow Sleevers...I've played too long with your *game*... And my quotes: Those who have nothing positive to contribute should not say nothing at all.

For *some* it REQUIRES yelling, because they can't seem to comprehend what I was trying to say. And comprehend O'Brien's video.

Your questions makes sense so I will respond .. In the OLD days when I got my band over 8 years ago, we were all taught one of the "golden lap band rules" were to NEVER drink while we ate, because this would push the food through, and if this occurred we would seemingly defeat the purpose of the band and get hungrier between meals sooner, and not lose as much weight. Some surgeons had a 30/30 rule some had a 60/60 rule of waiting up to 1 hour or 30 minutes to stop drinking any liquid and wait 1 hour to 30 minutes. However, O'Brien and other "very successful" lap band clinics learned that not only there is NO advantage to the old 30/30 and 60/60 rules specially for LAP BAND patients it CAN cause esophageal dilation LONG TERM in many lap banders. Because MANY who followed the 30/30 - 60/60 rules, their food NEVER went past the band, or the food would sit in the esophagus too long and in some lap band patients this eventually caused the esophagus to dilate (or create a new small stomach in the esophagus) AND IF THIS OCCURS -- IT ALWAYS REQUIRE LAP BAND REMOVAL AND THE PATIENT CAN NEVER BE A CANDIDATE FOR THE BAND.....any longer. Esophageal dilation IS DIFFERENT than Pouch dilation, if someone develops a larger pouch they CAN always get this fixed surgically, so Pouch dilation is not as harmless as esophageal dilation, but both are lap band complications but different issues. And to answer your last question : So the theory of clearing the food so it doesn't sit there constantly day after day meal after meal makes a bit of sense. But then doesn't also defeat the purpose of the band? I mean isn't that where you would feel your restriction? If it dumps on your full sized stomach won't you still be able to eat more food? Oh by the way I don't know squat I'm a sleever! Here is the thing...MANY US Lap band surgeons DO NOT KNOW HOW THE LAP BAND WORK....some still fill their patients too tight and send them on their merry way with no instructions, etc....hence why there is a VERY HIGH complication rate. Based on O'Brien and other skilled lap band surgeons, including Dr. Simpson.... The lap band DOES NOT WORK UNTIL ABOUT 1-2 HOURS AFTER WE EAT, meaning, it should never make us full to the point of being stuffed, we should eat slowly wait a few minutes let that food go down, take another bite, or even take a sip of liquid between bites and let that go down and after eating slowing for about 15-20 minutes of about 1/2 to 1 cup of solid food, IF WE ARE IN THE GREEN ZONE, we should be satisfied and STOP EATING...THAT'S HOW THE LAP BAND SHOULD WORK, BASED ON NEW RESEARCH FROM THE FOUNDER WHO CREATED THE GREEN ZONE CHART. Some surgical clinics DO NOT FOLLOW THIS, and MANY US surgical practices have very high long term lap band complications rates, IN FACT, MANY surgeons are no longer doing bands because they were removing more than they were putting in...which CREATED THE NEW RAVE FOR THE SLEEVE....IN THE LAST 4 YEARS....BECAUSE THERE WERE SO MANY HAVING TO GET THEIR BANDS REMOVED.. Will everyone have issues down the road? We don't know, but based on the last 10 years those clinics that don't follow Dr. O'Briens green zone chart and this NEW REVISED 10 Golden rules with the band tend to have more complications..... NOW there is a NEW TURNAROUND FOR THE LAP BAND...SURGEONS ARE NOW LEARNING AND ADOPTING...O'Briens new rules and with a "safer" band, things have started to turnaround for the band....

Yea you have no reason to prove your POINT, because you don't HAVE ONE...LMAO.. You are here just to stir up trouble, and FEED attacks against me, that's all, aka a troublemaker... Also I have NO CLUE of what you are talking about and why I am wasting my keystrokes in responding to you. If you can't respond WITH studies and cited materials of what you are blabbing about...I will no longer respond to your nonsense. Until you can PROVE what you are trying to say....I will no longer respond to you. Until then Goodbye.

Why can't you keep the debate on the SUBJECT instead of personal attacks? Or is it that you can't come up with any type of articulate way to argue MY POINT of this post? If you can CLEARLY argue your POINT WITH BACKED UP STUDIES AND PROOF OF YOUR POINT, LIKE I DID IN THIS POST....then you'd clearly HAVE A DEBATABLE POINT...BUT UNTIL THEN YOU HAVE NOT PROVED YOUR POINT...NOW WHO LOOKS LIKE A FOOL? LMAO I can call you and the rest of the people that are now blocked REALLY ugly names, but again then I would be accused of being MEAN, ARROGANT and a "KNOW IT ALL"... Now wouldn't I be?

deleted..

That's OK...I just wanted to put it out there in laymen terms....since MANY do not Know the difference between the Lap band, Sleeve or Bypass stomachs.... and how they work

You are correct this is the best thread EVER, I am not sure Sleeve and Bypass folks are so interested in it. We lap banders are DIFFERENT than Sleevers and Bypass people. Sleeves have little Sleeved stomachs, that IS stapled, Sleeved stomachs RAPIDLY empties, and sometimes can cause dumping like and hypoglycemic symptoms if drinking or eating sweets or carbs. Bypass people have a "stoma" that IS stapled, Bypass stomachs RAPIDLY empties, and sometimes can cause dumping syndrome and hypoglycemic symptoms if drinking or eating sweets or carbs. Lap Banders DO NOT HAVE stapled stomachs, we DO NOT have dumpling syndrome because our FOOD does not rapidly empties....the band is designed to slowly empty from the esophagus into the stomach....we DO NOT technically have a pouch, our band is sutured around our stomach, the band makes a little pouch area around the top of the stomach that separates the lower esophagus from the stomach area and our food slowly slowly dumps from the esophagus into the stomach... Sleeved and Bypass people are told NOT eat drink while eating, because their anatomy is different....there is NO reason for Lap Banders to do this because our FOOD slowly dumps from our esophagus into our stomach.... Lap Band surgeons in the US have followed BYPASS rules and adopted that SAME rule for lap banders and after years of research Dr. O'Brien changed this RULE for lap banders in Australia because there is no advantage to NOT drink 20 minutes after eating....

JennyBean, You are a voice of reason and very smart, and I applaud you for that. You are wise to take what helps you and use it to your advantage. You are wise enough to listen to your surgical team, but also wise enough to KNOW that they may not tell you EVERYTHING about the band to be successful and complication free long term. Lap banders TODAY have an advantage that I did not have years ago. The blind were leading the blind, I remember many use to think VOMITING (Pbing) daily was a sign of achievement of the SWEET SPOT....LOL. I remember a friend of mine on another forum was distraught (very sadden) that after 1 year she no longer vomited (several times per day) hence her food NEVER WENT PAST THE BAND, I am serious, she said that her band would no longer tighten to the point of her having to "vomit" every single day, turns out her band was so tight that her food never went past the band, and over time it stretched out her esophagus because the food just sat in her esophagus and made a "new" little stomach inside her esophagus....this is a frequent long term complication too, esophageal dilation and dismotility that MANY long term lap banders get. so she had a revision to the Bypass and that was over 7 years ago, I don't know how she is doing now, but that story is many lap band revision stories. The moral of this post is that many people NEVER REALLY knew how the band was suppose to work long term, yea they lost weight, but their banded journey eventually turned into a horror story -- and I've read MANY horror stories, this is why I am passionate about the band, I just hate to see many lose their bands for nothing.

AND Oh...I forgot to mention...remember the Green Zone that everyone follows? O'Brien wrote that chart level too, so instead of writing a fruitless post to me, if you don't agree with O'Brien;s protocol on the lap band please send email him, he has a website.....He did not create the Green Zone chart and his new updated drinking rule while eating WITHOUT PROOF and clinic studies on the consequences of what can happen long term....

MamaJamma, I totally AGREE with you, NEVER STOP doing what you are doing to be successful! I am NO authority on the lap band, it's not my business profession, I was just repeating what Dr.O'BRIEN' article and video says....and wanted to know to Poll others if they were now following HIS ADVICE.... I clearly don't understand what you MEAN by telling others to keep doing what they are doing as IF I AM SUGGESTING THEM TO STOP.-- is this some type of "code language" that I don't understand because I AM not suggesting OR DO I CARE what others do with their lap bands. I just thought I would put this information out there regarding keeping food flowing through the band AS DR' O'BRIEN suggest.... instead of possibly allowing food to stretch the esophagus overtime....HIS WORDS NOT MINE.... If ANYONE ELSE REPLY TO THIS POST AND SUGGEST that I AM CREATING THIS NEW GOLDEN RULE OF DRINKING WITH MEALS, OR I AM AN AUTHORITY --- PLEASE VOICE ALL OF YOUR CONCERNS and write a letter to O'Brien, who has the most successful long term lap band clinic in the world...and question HIM NOT ME... Good grief....I

And that's OK,...and I respect YOUR opinion and please respect MINE....that's why I said to PLEASE use the block button to make YOUR experience and mine more peaceful.

I am open to debates, and people who don't agree with me, but I AM NOT open to abuse....if someone comes at me in a negative way instead of ATTACKING the subject, then I fight back -- TIT FOR TAT...know one sends me nasty emails and expect me to just accept it.... Also MANY DO respect ME and my opinions, just because a particular "gang" doesn't, does not mean everyone does.... AGAIN those who don't respect my opinion or what I have to say or what I have to contribute can simply block me, it will make my time here and theirs more pleasant, it's nothing wrong with customizing your journey here. is there?

What is a KNOW it all? I don't just post willy nilly stuff without backing it up with cited materials or things that I've LEARNED and seen others go through over the years clinically by other surgeons and Bariatric professionals. Call it arrogant or whatever, that's your prerogative. That being said, most veterans like myself really don't have to post to share what worked for us, or have seen others go through with their lap bands. Also I learned MANY things over the years from OTHER lap band veterans that my surgeon(s) did not have a clue about, so sometimes learning from others who've BEEN THERE and DONE THAT with band is just AS important as cited materials, in my opinion. Many are getting invaluable FREE advice here on a Public forum OPEN TO EVERYONE. If you are the type of person from a small town and DON'T like diversity or opinions of others and only like to get YOUR advice from people that you *LIKE* AND CLICK with, please block me, because that will surely help me, because I don't want to waste my fingers helping someone that have other agendas here. I honestly don't have to spend one key stroke of advice here. I can just lurk and observe and keep quiet when people are in need, but I thought I would give back.When I was a newbie over 8 years ago, there were not that many long term veteran bandsters, but I sure WELCOMED their advice and their experiences whether good or bad, I am smart enough to filter out any advice that is not applicable to my own situation and take all information here with a grain of salt, and HOPEFULLY everyone else does the same. My advice that I've given here IS NOT GOSPEL and if anyone have read my post, they should be smart enough to take the information what they can use and discard the rest. We are unique individuals with different medical conditions, different types of anatomy, metabolisms, etc. Also, many think that their banded life will be the EXACT same forever, if they are in the "clear" today with NO issues, does not mean they will be in the "clear" in the next few years, so I think everyone should LEARN as much as they can about the band whether negative or positive. In fact each of our banded journey will be a bit different, some people complain about throwing up and not being able to eat healthy foods, I've never had that problem EVEN with a tightly restricted band (with two bands), so I honestly can't relate to some of these people's issues, I can just advise them based on what I've seen others go through over 8 years and THEY can either take that advice or ignore it. Regarding O'Brien, and his studies, many surgeons highly respect him, his updated information about no longer waiting to drink after 20 minutes has been out there on the internet in his videos now for about 3 years --- so I just REPEATED this information in my last post I am not sure how many here got so uptight about it, when it's been out there for a few years. I don't understand why many people here got angry OVER O'Briens advice or ANY advice about the band, NO one is pointing a gun to your head to make you take this advice, some people follow the 10 golden rules, some only follow a few of the rules...and many don't follow nothing...but that's YOUR prerogative I know that I will ALWAYS be humble and thankful for ANYONE posting here, whether it be complications, failures, successes, problem with surgeons, etc. -- ALL this information is valuable. Honestly the reason I put all of this information out here is that I've gotten sick and tired of hearing band bashing and so many having preventable complications. Even though I've been a member here over 7 years, I don't have that many posts here because I've ALWAYS been a happy lap bander, and not needed to post that much here, even when I experienced a bump in my journey last year and had to get a hernia repaired which caused me to get my old band replaced. My band changed my life, I got to wear cute clothes, got down as low as a size 8, maintained my weight loss for over 7 years with no problem, went on dating sprees, and dating guys that I thought I could never date and had the time of my life, married a wonderful guy 3 years ago, travel constantly, etc...so to say the band has not helped change my life is an understatement. I had not posted IN years, when I came back Alex welcomed me back and hopefully EVERYONE should feel welcomed to post here to share their journeys whether good or bad, some think they are invincible and NOTHING will never happen to them, My advice on that is learn, learn as much as you can about the band and always be cautious but yet positive and optimistic. I am a very happy and VERY successful long term lap bander and LUV my Band .

I would call the surgeon if the reflux is really bad, you should not have to wait, also you may want to only do full liquids like Soups until you can figure out what is going on. Also most newly post ops don't really get reflux, the cheese is kind a thick too this early out. You may be progressing too quickly, everyone has different post diet plans, but I did not eat thick cheese or pinto bean until about after 6 weeks post op.

Hi Bandista, Sorry about this thread turning into a train wreak.... I don't know why you are confused about my post, I was just repeating what Dr. O'Brien mentioned, OTHERS just made it more confusing. Dr. O'Brien clearly says in his videos, they've learned over the years, there is no advantage to wait 20 minutes to drink after eating. In fact he also suggest to drink a glass a wine with a meal WHILE eating, but again, he mentioned to wait and chew your food and wait until that food goes down before taking a sip of wine. One of the many lap band golden rules have always been to wait either 30 minutes or even up to 1 hour to drink to keep from washing the food through...but again O'Brien mention that after several studies and clinical research there IS NO ADVANTAGE to this. This was the POINT of my post apparently many can't seem to understand this. However, this does not mean for you to NOT follow your surgeons rules, so please do not get confused by what I post.... every surgical practice does not follow Dr. O'Brien but MANY do, since Dr. O'Brien has one of the most successful lap Band practices in the world and has very low long term complication rates. Unfortunately, if I block you, you can still see my posts ...apparently the technical staff has not yet mastered that functionality yet to have both the blocked and blockee to not see each others posts. Don't worry NO more posts like this...I will only talk about sex for the next few months.... :wub: '

You are newly post op, and your reflux is a bit different, you should talk to your surgeon about this. But in the meantime you probably don't want to advance your diet and only take small teaspoons of food. If he put 2ccs in there, you are probably still swollen. If it were me I'd stick to liquids for a few weeks, it sounds like you had a hiatal hernia, did he repair one for you?

Damn...Damn Damn...you mean to tell me that ALL those people that I've just blocked can STILL read my posts? I thought Alex said this would be fixed in this new rollout...ARG! I guess we need to ping him on that new functionality which is a MUST! Because you will get stalkers that will constantly terrorize ..... I've blocked just about half the people in this post, hopefully they get it -- that I can't see their posts and responding to me a fruitless..LOL...

Quoted Betterthe Bean Just curious.....which doctor said this? You've stated so many times how bariatric surgeons in this country don't know anything, so how could the surgeon who doled out this little gem about hypoglycemia 30 years post op be trusted to know anything at all? Perhaps he's just as ignorant as the rest of the bariatric surgeons we used. After all, where are his YouTube videos backing up his claims? Hello...ButtertheBean, If you read my posts carefully I've NEVER said ALL US Bariatric surgeons don't know anything, I said to always question surgeons and get second opinions if necessary and ALWAYS be proactive with your own health. Regarding Hypoglycemia - Yes my older sister had stomach stapling surgery over 30 years ago when she was 24 years old, (similar to the Sleeve) and she has had part of her stomach removed as well she she developed ulcers from the stomach staples years ago. She's had those hypoglycemia attacks for many years, but not to the extreme as she is having them now. I've seen how she has lived with this surgery over the years and she's had many stomach problems and pain, however she's never had a problem so severe that required hospitalization, she did have to get her gall bladder removed years ago also. Now she has started to get scared for her life because the attacks are more frequent (daily) and it is causing her to be disabled, she gets really hot, dizzy and her blood pressure drops to almost fainting, a few weeks ago at the casino she fell over people and could not make it to the ladies room, they had to call the paramedics, long term Hypoglycemia can be deadly. She has been to several specialists and they got no answers, only to tell her to keep a strict diet, and she can't eat many carbs without feeling sick, and now have to keep candy and crackers with her at all times, to combat the severity of the attacks, this is when the Bariactric surgeon told her that this can happen with any stomach stapling surgery such as VBG, Sleeve, RNY or DS since the stapled small stomach causing rapid emptying of the stomach that can create these bad side effects, but in many they can get chronic and debilitating over the years. Many Sleeved friends of mine complain of (dumping like syndrome) which is probably Hypoglycemic as well. There are clinical trials right now being done on Bypass and Sleeve patients for long term Hypoglycemia Here are links to some of the studies. http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01581801 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22773085 The primary aim of the present study is to conduct a 1-year randomized trial to compare the incidence of hypoglycemia after RYGB or SG. Condition Intervention Obesity With Complications Morbid Obesity Reactive Hypoglycemia Bariatric Surgery Procedure: Gastric Bypass Procedure: Sleeve Gastrectomy Study Type: Interventional Study Design: Allocation: Randomized Endpoint Classification: Safety/Efficacy Study Intervention Model: Parallel Assignment Masking: Open Label Primary Purpose: Treatment Official Title: RANDOMIZED CLINICAL STUDY COMPARING THE EFFECT OF ROUX-en-Y GASTRIC BYPASS AND SLEEVE GASTRECTOMY ON REACTIVE HYPOGLYCEMIA Resource links provided by NLM: MedlinePlus related topics: Diabetes Medicines Hypoglycemia Obesity Weight Loss Surgery U.S. FDA Resources Further study details as provided by Catholic University of the Sacred Heart: Primary Outcome Measures: incidence reactive hypoglycemia [ Time Frame: up to 12 months ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ]The Primary Endpoint of the study is the incidence reactive hypoglycemia within 1 year after the bariatric surgery. Secondary Outcome Measures: insulin resistance [ Time Frame: 0,1,3,6,9, and 12 months ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ] Changes at 1 year of insulin sensitivity and insulin secretion measured after an OGTT. Changes at 1 year of body weight, BMI, abdominal circumference, body composition, lipid profile and cardiovascular system abnormalities. the incidence of severe hypoglycemia or related symptoms (shakiness, sweating, dizziness or light-headedness, confusion, difficulty speaking, weakness, confusion, syncope, epilepsy, seizures) within 5 years after the operation. Estimated Enrollment: 50 Study Start Date: October 2012 Estimated Study Completion Date: December 2014 Estimated Primary Completion Date: August 2014 (Final data collection date for primary outcome measure) Arms Assigned Interventions Gastric Bypass25 subjects obese subjects with complications or morbidly obese subjects will be assigned randomly to this arm to undergo gastric bypassProcedure: Gastric Bypass Roux-en-Y Gastric Bypass This laparoscopic operation includes the division of the stomach in two parts. A proximal, smaller pouch (20-25 cc volume), is connected to the rest of the gastrointestinal tract through a gastro-jejunal anastomosis, whereas the distal gastric pouch is left behind but excluded from the transit of food. An entero-entero anastomosis, with a Roux-en-Y type of reconstruction, allows the bile and pancreatic juices to mix with the nutrients at about 100-150 cm from the gastro-jejunal connection. Sleeve Gastrectomy25 subjects obese subjects with complications or morbidly obese subjects will be assigned randomly to this arm to undergo sleeve gastrectomyProcedure: Sleeve GastrectomySleeve gastrectomy Laparoscopic SG involves a longitudinal resection of the stomach on the greater curvature from the antrum starting opposite of the nerve of Latarjet up to the angle of His The final gastric volume is about 100 mL.

Thanks for that tip, I've always washed my fruit and veggies in hot soapy water before eating them. I am clean freak ..LOL...I can't stand getting sick! But I've never heard of the vinegar and water, seems like the vinegar would change the taste?

JennyBean, You are correct, many surgeons DO NOT know how to live with the band or give instructions on what to do, even after all these years. There was not much clinical experience in the US when I got my band placed, surgeons were learning with patients and some are still learning. I learned most of what I know from other veteran bandsters and doing my OWN research. Many surgeons really did not teach patients about the sweet spot or dangers to look for.Everyone will say...Oh I will ONLY listen to my surgeon, but if SURGEONS were so knowledgeable about living with the band and preventing complications with it there would not be a VERY high long term complication rate with it. You are correct we are all guinea pigs, my sister had stomach stapling surgery 30 years ago when she was only 24 years old, NOW she is 30 years post ope and in her mid-50's and she has just starting having serious hypoglycemia attacks that scares her daily, she's always had them, but not to this extreme where she almost fainted while walking in the mall. The doctor told her that this can happen to any stomach stapling surgery such as RNY, Sleeve, or DS, this is why I would never get any anything other than the band, at least if anything goes wrong I can get it removed.

Wow, what an ordeal. Good to hear you are on the mend and healing. Surgeons are suppose to have different size bands readily available once they get in to determine which size that will fit your anatomy. Strange though I've always heard of others having to drink barium after surgery, I've had two bands and never had to do any of that post op. Typically surgeons will prime the band with Fluid to check for defects, but the fluid in the band during installation really should not make you too tight unless it's just too small for your stomach. Ideally the band should not be too tight with priming fluid, if it is, as you can see that band was just too small for your stomach. Hopefully this new band works out great for you.