Miss California and Gay marriage

BethFromVA · April 28, 2009

Sorry, I saw the word "bigot" and lost track of everything else that was said. My fault. :unsure:

Jachut · April 28, 2009

Oh - yes, I edited because I rethought even introducing that word, this forum is playing up so terribly today because as you'll see the word is no longer there. It just took about 10 minutes for my edit to process.

But I certainly wasnt calling anyone a bigot!

babygrl1234 · April 28, 2009

Personally I applaud her for sticking to her convictions. Good for her for not selling out just to try and win a beauty pageant (it's not a beauty pageant-it's a scholorship program, sorry I love that movie). However, I couldn't agree with her less. I rest pretty far over on the conservative Christian republican side and I still can't understand why people have such a big issue with the whole one man one woman thing. What is so awful about what someone else does with their lives? Does a gay marriage make my marriage any less important? I don't think other peoples marriages have any affect on mine. Straight, gay, black, white, whatever. It doesn't affect me, but it does affect those two gay people involved in the relationship. Why should they be denied the same benefits that come along with being married that the rest of us get. If my husband were sick and dying in the hospital I would be able to be there by his side. Yet if the same happened to one of my gay friends, who has been in a relationship nearly longer than I have been in existance, they may not be given the same opportunity? It is bullshit. My marriage is defined by how my husband and I live our lives together. Not by a 20 year old marrying a 89 year old man for money, or a man marrying a woman for "control", or two lesbian who love each other very much and want to make their lives into one. My life is my life and no one defines it for me.

pattygreen · April 28, 2009

I think everyone has a right to say what thier beliefs are, so here's mine. My son is gay, he has a good job, pays taxes, gives back to the community with volunteer work and was in the service. He doesn't have the same rights as a person serving time in jail for murder!!! I think until he has the same rights as everyone else he should stop paying taxes! The goverment should work for him too! Also I would never have him married in any church, they think he's an abomination, as a matter of fact my whole family has turned away from the church and I for one will not be associated with them. I hope if there is a heaven, God judges people on earth the way they judge others.

I, too, have family members who are gay. A sister and a nephew. I love them dearly. It's not about who you know and love. It's about cahnging what 'marriage' is and means.

I don't agree that marriage is a 'right' for anyone in this country. Is it 2 sisters 'right' to marry each other if they choose? Where in the constitution does it say that the institution of marriage is every persons right? For instance, I don't have a 'right' to give you a speeding ticket. That is only a police officers 'right'.

BTW, the 'church' are the people who believe in God. And, it's not the people who made the decision that homosexuality is a sin. It was God who said that. So, your problem is with God, not the people who believe in him. And, finally, I believe there is a heaven, but God doesn't judge people the way they judge each other.

pattygreen · April 28, 2009

Yeah, I don't think she lost the title just for her views. She's a pretty atrocious speaker. However, she is entitled to speak her opinion when asked.....even if the expression is unpopular, or delivered in an extremely awkward manner.

I don't think she lost the title simply because of her views either. I just wanted to comment on your post because I wanted you to be aware that her response to the question asked was NOT the UNpopular answer.

Edited April 28, 2009 by pattygreen

pattygreen · April 28, 2009

I think Miss California showed great character by standing by her beliefs! I respect her so much for holding true to them, even though it was not popular. I agree with her.
I believe that when two people are committed to each other, that they should be allowed to have some of the same rights of other couples. I do NOT believe that they should be able to change the definition of marriage. Why does the gay community insist on calling it marriage? Why are they pushing for that particular word? It almost seems like they are forcing their lifestyle on the rest of the world, and are upset when we don't want it. For example: The whole Prop 8 thing. When the people of California voiced their opinion through voting, the gay community was in an uproar. They are always talking about how they are being oppressed, and how they want more rights. But when vote took place, in a legal and fair way, where they could exercise their right to vote, the people of California made a choice. EVERYONE had the right to vote on Prop 8, and the voters made their decision.

Everyone has the right to their opinion, and Miss California was brave enough to state hers to the world. I really look up to her for being that courageous!

You said that beautifully, and I agree with you. Christians are being intimidated in this country to back down on their beliefs because they might offend some. Well, what about the homosexuals that are offending Christians by calling them extremists and telling them to apologize for what they believe in? They should apologize to her for even asking her to apologize for her opinion.

pattygreen · April 28, 2009

i just think its really sad that all people are still not getting equal rights. why is it such a problem to some people if two homosexuals get married. they make vows to one another... some do so in a church or temple before G*D... they get married in every sense of the word. I for one beleive G*D sees it as a holy union the same as with a heterosexual couple.
My best friend is gay, and i want for him all the rights that i enjoy as a heterosexual woman. I want him to fall in love, get married, have children if he chooses to. i truely beleive in a G*D who created us as equal, and treats us as equals, loves us as equals. I feel sad for those who beleive in an intolerent, hateful G*D.

amy

God is not hateful. He is very loving, but he hates sin. All sin. Even gluttony. He loves the person, but hates their sinful choices. God is the one who tells us what sin is in the scriptures. If a person believes in his Son, Jesus, they will be accepted by God, despite their sin. But first they must recognize and acknowledge that they are sinning. That's the key.

pattygreen · April 28, 2009

The reason why the christian community wants to keep the term marriage for 2 opposite sexes only is because God said that this is what's right. Little by little by little over time this country is slowly changing from what the founding Fathers originally had planned. This was originally a 'Christian' nation. A nation that believed in God and all that God stood for. We, as christians, are being forced to hand over our beliefs to appease the 'offenses' of the minority. We've already taken prayer out of the schools to 'appease' the minority of atheists, and the 10 Commandments out of public places and in court rooms, (yet they still swear the oath to tell the truth and nothing but the truth on a bible) the minority are trying to take 'In God We Trust' off our money, 'Under God" out of our pledge, etc. We allow abortions in this country, too. Before you know it the president wont be able to swear into office on a bible or say God Bless America at the end of his speeches any more.

What I'm trying to say is ...Homosexuality is a sin. God said so, and it's wrong. Noone is telling anyone they can't live that way if they choose. Just like smoking cigarettes is a sin and it's wrong, it harms your body, but noone is telling anyone they can't smoke if they want to. Just because you choose that lifestyle for yourself, doesn't mean the majority have to accept it as 'marriage'.

IMO, I think that homosexuals feel that they need to force this acceptance on christians and those who disagree with their choice or they will not feel 'accepted' or justified. Well, if they feel it's ok to live the way they are, then who cares what others think? Why must their union be called 'marriage'? As a civil union they can have all the same rights associated with marriage. All of them, except the title 'marriage' because that title was ordained by God for one man and one woman.

BethFromVA · April 28, 2009

Oh - yes, I edited because I rethought even introducing that word, this forum is playing up so terribly today because as you'll see the word is no longer there. It just took about 10 minutes for my edit to process.
But I certainly wasnt calling anyone a bigot!

No problem, Jachut. Thanks for clarifying. :unsure:

BethFromVA · April 28, 2009

Personally I applaud her for sticking to her convictions. Good for her for not selling out just to try and win a beauty pageant (it's not a beauty pageant-it's a scholorship program, sorry I love that movie). However, I couldn't agree with her less. I rest pretty far over on the conservative Christian republican side and I still can't understand why people have such a big issue with the whole one man one woman thing. What is so awful about what someone else does with their lives? Does a gay marriage make my marriage any less important? I don't think other peoples marriages have any affect on mine. Straight, gay, black, white, whatever. It doesn't affect me, but it does affect those two gay people involved in the relationship.

For me, I just can't support it. Like I said, I wouldn't riot in the streets or picket or anything if it passed, but when asked for my vote, I can't vote yes. It has nothing to do with how it may or may not/does or does not affect my marriage, it's just a moral conviction on my part, and I would stand by my conviction the same as she did.

Why should they be denied the same benefits that come along with being married that the rest of us get. If my husband were sick and dying in the hospital I would be able to be there by his side. Yet if the same happened to one of my gay friends, who has been in a relationship nearly longer than I have been in existance, they may not be given the same opportunity? It is bullshit.

And I do agree here. I don't know why marriage has to determine who can visit whom in the hospital or how property gets disbursed if one were to die, etc. I believe two people living together should be able to legally and contractually determine that ahead of time, which then trumps any family wishes. They should have that right to determine things between themselves, and that should be able to be done legally.

babygrl1234 · April 28, 2009

For me, I just can't support it. Like I said, I wouldn't riot in the streets or picket or anything if it passed, but when asked for my vote, I can't vote yes. It has nothing to do with how it may or may not/does or does not affect my marriage, it's just a moral conviction on my part, and I would stand by my conviction the same as she did.

And that is perfectly fine. And completely your right.

Perez Hilton is just blowing this whole thing out of proportion. everything is all fine and dandy with him as long as it aligns with his opinion of life. But when someone goes against how he feels, watch out. Then there is a personal vendetta. He is the worlds biggest hypocrite, as evidenced on how he makes fun of Jessica Simpson for her weight gain, yet praises Beth Ditto (or whatever her name is) from The Gossip on being so hot.

BethFromVA · April 28, 2009

And that is perfectly fine. And completely your right.
Perez Hilton is just blowing this whole thing out of proportion. everything is all fine and dandy with him as long as it aligns with his opinion of life. But when someone goes against how he feels, watch out. Then there is a personal vendetta. He is the worlds biggest hypocrite, as evidenced on how he makes fun of Jessica Simpson for her weight gain, yet praises Beth Ditto (or whatever her name is) from The Gossip on being so hot.

And omg, how he responded to Miss California, calling her a "dumb bitch" on his blog. He's a piece of crap, pure and simple.

Oh, and the weight gain thing? You're so right. And until recently, he was a fatso himself. Hypocrite.

luluc · April 28, 2009

sorta how i feel.

honestly my marriage has last longer, than the sneeze of my husbands first one - which was all church & glitter.......we eloped to vegas, filled out our application in orange crayon & i'm pretty sure was married by a gay lounge singer.

at the end of the day, it's legal & he would get half if we divorced...LOL:wink:

personally i think the govt' should get out of the marriage business & leave that to those who feel the importance to have their union blessed by xxxx fill in blank "religion".

i do believe that we will see civil unions in the future for all - at least i hope so...cause really this is a legal commitment no matter how you look at it.

regarding ms california; she did sound like a box of rocks & while perez hilton is a media whore, his question was cleared by the producers of the program & they got exactly what they wanted out of it......people still talking & the youtube clip constantly viewed.

i don't agree w/her answer - but it's hers & she owned as inarticulate as she sounded.

Nanook · April 28, 2009

Well I guess if you dont believe that God instituted marriage but that it is a man conceived legal arrangement which affords both partners certain rights and is also a socially respected, very traditional way to publically declare love and commitment between two people then you wouldnt see a reason in the world why gay couples dont have the same rights to this as heterosexual couples.
I really believe anyone who cant see that or wont accept that is splitting hairs over the marriage issue to hide the fact that they really dont believe a relationship between two people of the same sex can be as loving and committed as a relationship betwee two people of opposite sex.

Your post was not really about Miss California, it was more a chance to make your statement on what you think about gay marriage (an opinion to which you are entitled of course), correct? So you want people's views on this and not on Ms California?

Nevertheless, I believe she is courageous and has integrity for sticking by her belief however warped they may be. Good on her, the whole gay marriage cause does not need a bunch of homophobic hypocrite who do not really believe in the issue but want to say/do the socially acceptable thing.

Well said Jachut, Nancy:thumbup:

BethFromVA · April 28, 2009

the whole gay marriage cause does not need a bunch of homophobic hypocrite who do not really believe in the issue but want to say/do the socially acceptable thing.

I see now what got modified in this post, and I guess I have to ask: Why is it if somebody doesn't believe in something, it automatically makes them homophobic? Or are you just speaking of some people?

People can be anti- something and not be phobic.