Fear of Chickening Out

[TboneGA 4]

63 and have never written to a forum like this on any subject. Like many I tried numerous programs, over the last 15 to 20 years, to address my slowly increasing weight, but nothing worked for more than a month or so. My problem is not eating poor quality meals, generally over eating at meal time, routinely eating badly (rarely go to a McDonald's except driving on vacation) or having a trigger food like cake or ice cream. My problem is I have no clue what hunger really feels like anymore. I can easily go all day with out eating but then once I start at dinner I can't/don't stop eating. I can eat a Thanks Giving meal, stuffed to the point of being sick, and then still turn around and stuff something else in. Clearly not hunger. I am not a moody or depressed person so while there is likely an emotional component to this it is not obvious what it is. At the advice of nutritionists I have tried lots of things (e.g., sip a cup of tee, find another activity to keep your mind occupied, go for a walk) to break this habit. All of those are pleasant, but they actually feed the compulsion much like how a dog acts staring at dog biscuit outside its crate. Bottom-line its uncontrollable, mind-less, snacking.

So pardon the long winded lead in, but this is causing me angst as my surgery date approaches so a couple questions for the experienced members.

• Having read a lot about the diet restrictions I worry that not having good mental control over my eating behavior could cause problems. Mindless eating by its nature is uncontrolled and I wonder if others have found this problematic and if so how did they deal with it.
• Are holidays and special occasions ever the same post surgery? The euphemism "pigging-out" is actually something pleasurable beyond just food. For example most holidays and special occasions have a component of overeating. Almost seems that once you have the surgery those pleasures are a thing of the past. How do you break this or is it always a struggle? I've been thinking a lot about my favorite holidays (i.e., Christmas, Thanks Giving, Fourth of July) and in my mind I hear "Maybe I should just try a conventional diet program again at least I'll still be able to enjoy turkey, mashed potatoes and pumpkin pie at Christmas".
• I travel a fair amount for work. I have actually delayed the surgery until summer when my travel and speaking schedule slow for a few months. I am scheduled for surgery the third week of June which is three weeks after my last trip. Then I don't have anything else scheduled until early September but that is in Europe. I have read a lot of posts but I have not found many that outline traveling success recommendations. While there is some entertaining in the mix it is not excessive I am more interested in how people manage a restrictive diet around the chaotic schedules of business travelers.
• Last but not least. One of my bucket list items has long been to ride a bicycle across the country from coast to coast. Before I even contemplated the surgery I started making plans for when I might be able to do this and how I could go about making it happen. One of the big issues was certainly my weight which would be helped by the surgery. However, again with the diet restrictions and hydration needs I wonder if there are any challenges or problems with long endurance activities like this. Currently this would be a couple years post surgery so healing should be complete, my concern is are there problems with dehydration.

After scanning this long message seems I am a politician, which I am not. If anyone cares to comments I don't expect people to respond to all of my questions. Probably should have written more than one message but this was stream of consciousness.

[newself 98]

People always wonder why I'm overweight. I don't really eat fast food, but I ate all day long and my Snacks were not really snacks; they were the same calorie count as a "normal meal." My high weight was 240 over the years, I got it down 20 lbs repeatedly but it was incredibly hard and took months and months, only to rebound. This surgery was a last ditch effort to feel good in my skin, mentally and physically. I had to pay out of pocket because I did not have a co morbidity and a 34 bmi, so obviously this was not a life and death surgery for me.

That is my background. This is not an easy road, BUT it will teach you to slow down and eat much, much less food. No, you will not be able to pig out but you will be able to have a bite or two of your favorite foods and be satisfied. I am able to enjoy each bite without shoveling in as much as possible. At celebration events you will taste a little bit of various foods and not have that bulging full feeling that feels horrible. I know this is hard to believe, but I do not miss the gorging at the holidays. I feel a huge amount of pride and control over my body and choices.

I'm only 7.5 weeks out but I can say this is the best things I've ever done for myself! I've lost 26.8 lbs as of last week.

Like you I have never been a part of a forum or read any but, here is so much wisdom on these pages, and I have learned so much.

[Kay07 734]

Hello, very nice to ‘meet’ you. Welcome to the forums! I can help answer some of these.

1: a good friend of mine who had this surgery is a big traveler. She is on the road a lot for work, and for personal pleasure. She had the surgery in May 2017. Spent the later part of June and early July in India, departing 4 weeks after surgery. She did a lot of research about food options and networked with our Indian office to make sure she was prepared with what she should eat. Sometimes Protein supplements are difficult to tie down in other countries. She made it work. After that trip, she spent a long time in Europe, which she said was incredibly easy compared to India and had no struggles.

2. Another friend of mine is an AVID biker and had her surgery in Jan 2016. She completed a shorter Maine to Boston trip over 3 days in the fall of 2017. She said she couldn’t have done it sooner than a year out, both from a weight perspective and ability. The rapid weight loss aside, you need to be at a place where you know your new body. Some people may be able to do this quicker than others. But you have to really know your body and have an understanding of your limits before you put yourself into a situation where you may be exposed to intense situations such as heat exposure and prolonged exercise. She trained for her trek for a few months before it took place and was able to complete it and have a wonderful time.

I am hoping to join her in a few years after my surgery, once I am at a stage where I am fit and in maintenance mode.

[Sosewsue61 3,185]

You need to cultivate other 'pleasures' other than food. This is the time to think about that relationship. Your body needs food, and food is a good experience for most of us after surgery, but it is not all there is....as the song goes. Not eating all day, then wolfing is a symptom of actually needing fuel, not being able to stop eating is a symptom of something emotional - a need to relieve anxiety, stress, to zone out, etc. You need to pay attention to that need and find another way - and biking might become that stress relief. Good luck on this journey to figure that out.

[Orchids&Dragons 9,046]

I doubt there's a person on the site who didn't have second, third, fourth thoughts about the surgery. It is a major life change that affects your own relationship with food, your relationship with family and friends, your way of celebrating, and your way of managing stress. This is why there are so many hoops to jump through before surgery gets approved. It's not easy, but neither is diabetes, high blood pressure, bad knees, etc. None of us is getting any younger :-)

[stacy@5 69]

You actually asked many of the same questions I’ve been wondering!! Am I doing the right thing? How will holidays ever be the same (considering I do most of the cooking)? Maybe I should try one more thing before I do the surgery? I also let my head get wrapped around what others are saying: your not that big/ your BM is not high enough/ your not trying hard enough to do it yourself/ it’s all in your head/ you’ll get to little and you’ll look sick/ I love you the way you are/🤦🏻‍♀️[emoji1496]‍♀️[emoji86][emoji31]!! I want to scream look, I am 48/49, 5’4”, HW 243, BM 42.2, HIgh blood pressure, borderline diabetic, sleep apnea, bad knees and lower back pain,and to top it off I can’t bend bend down and tie my own shoe without losing my breath!! HELLO!!!!! My surgery date for gastric bypass is May 18!! I wanted to do the sleeve but with acid reflux disease and my love for sweets the sleeve was not the best option for me!!

[mrsb305 3]

I did but was like its now or never and 2 weeks later did it...and I don't regret

DOS: 1/21/12
SW: 367 LBS
CW: 185 LBS

[Frustr8 7,886]

Hey Stacy, I was looking around the other obesity type web sites today. I have thought and my PCP does too because it's on my,print-out I get with each visit that I had a BMI of 47, this other one calculates me at 49. Shoot I am losing although very slowly, but having it jump 2 points when I've lost 30 lbs from my HW, makes a gal want to sit down , cry and give up.You,were talking about these "chicken hearted thoughts" my latest is that God,Mothet Nature or Father Time has placed a curse on me and that's why I can't have my,surgery any sooner📅. Gosh it's getting harder to see,everybody,passing me 🏃💖by and. making it to the Surgical Finish Line. I am starting to feel💖 like the,perpetual Bridesmaid, helping. every one else to get ready and I'm on the sidelines in my bridesmaid👗 dress,that needs altered waving 👋as they pass me,by,on their way to a new life. And nobody thinks to throw me the bouquet💐 Not sure if they take it with them or not, just know I didn't get it !😦

[Orchids&Dragons 9,046]

8 hours ago, Frustr8 said:

Hey Stacy, I was looking around the other obesity type web sites today. I have thought and my PCP does too because it's on my,print-out I get with each visit that I had a BMI of 47, this other one calculates me at 49. Shoot I am losing although very slowly, but having it jump 2 points when I've lost 30 lbs from my HW, makes a gal want to sit down , cry and give up.You,were talking about these "chicken hearted thoughts" my latest is that God,Mothet Nature or Father Time has placed a curse on me and that's why I can't have my,surgery any sooner📅. Gosh it's getting harder to see,everybody,passing me 🏃💖by and. making it to the Surgical Finish Line. I am starting to feel💖 like the,perpetual Bridesmaid, helping. every one else to get ready and I'm on the sidelines in my bridesmaid👗 dress,that needs altered waving 👋as they pass me,by,on their way to a new life. And nobody thinks to throw me the bouquet💐 Not sure if they take it with them or not, just know I didn't get it !😦

I'm so sorry that you're having to drag through the process so slowly. The bridesmaid analogy is a good one. I didn't get married until I turned 30 and my biological clock was booming like Big Ben. We're all rooting for you, hope you get to be the bride soon!

[Taoz 284]

53 minutes ago, Orchids&Dragons said:

I'm so sorry that you're having to drag through the process so slowly. The bridesmaid analogy is a good one. I didn't get married until I turned 30 and my biological clock was booming like Big Ben. We're all rooting for you, hope you get to be the bride soon!

I second this! I really hope you get your date and make it through to the other side with us May sleevers!!! You inject so much warmth and humour into these forums and deserve your day on the table ASAP!

[Taoz 284]

I think the fears are there for at least most of us, but we are here doing this because we know our own histories. We know how many times we tried so many things only to wind up heavier, less happy and less healthy in the long run.

To be successful in the long term we need better tools than "willpower" and all the dieting advice in the world. Bariatric surgery is the only tool proven to make significant weight loss maintenance in the long term possible for obese people (though not without the determination to work with that tool effectively).

This is not "cheating". This is finally getting the tool you need to succeed in weightloss and all the future benefits and opportunities that leads to. YOU CAN DO THIS!

[stacy@5 69]

I think the fears are there for at least most of us, but we are here doing this because we know our own histories. We know how many times we tried so many things only to wind up heavier, less happy and less healthy in the long run.
To be successful in the long term we need better tools than "willpower" and all the dieting advice in the world. Bariatric surgery is the only tool proven to make significant weight loss maintenance in the long term possible for obese people (though not without the determination to work with that tool effectively).
This is not "cheating". This is finally getting the tool you need to succeed in weightloss and all the future benefits and opportunities that leads to. YOU CAN DO THIS!

Thanks for your words of encouragement!!

[Ylime 453]

I posted this in one of your duplicate posts, but figured I would place it here too:

I have not yet had my surgery, but I have done a lot of research, spoke to a lot of people, and had a lengthy discussion with my surgeon about some of the issues you mention. So I'll share what I have learned and the advice I've been given.

• Having read a lot about the diet restrictions I worry that not having good mental control over my eating behavior could cause problems. Mindless eating by its nature is uncontrolled and I wonder if others have found this problematic and if so how did they deal with it.
  • My surgeon has instructed me to eliminate ALL distractions during meals to avoid mindless eating. No eating in front of the TV, while driving, or at the movies. This will certainly take some time to perfect as you have to change your mindset but it is something that has to be done to achieve willpower over mental cues/habits.
• Are holidays and special occasions ever the same post surgery? The euphemism "pigging-out" is actually something pleasurable beyond just food. For example most holidays and special occasions have a component of overeating. Almost seems that once you have the surgery those pleasures are a thing of the past. How do you break this or is it always a struggle? I've been thinking a lot about my favorite holidays (i.e., Christmas, Thanks Giving, Fourth of July) and in my mind I hear "Maybe I should just try a conventional diet program again at least I'll still be able to enjoy turkey, mashed potatoes and pumpkin pie at Christmas".
  • From people I have spoken to, holidays (and any meal really) is significantly different for two reasons: 1. The obvious that your stomach is now teeny and cannot hold nearly the capacity it once could and overeating can lead to becoming physically ill thereby teaching your brain that overeating is no longer a pleasant activity and 2. Due to the reduced amount you can eat and feeling fuller sooner, people have told me that food no longer runs their life. They have stated that where they used to be either eating or thinking of eating, their brains have shifted because the body doesn't need (and in some cases doesn't crave) food the same way. They now eat to live rather than live to eat.
• I travel a fair amount for work. I have actually delayed the surgery until summer when my travel and speaking schedule slow for a few months. I am scheduled for surgery the third week of June which is three weeks after my last trip. Then I don't have anything else scheduled until early September but that is in Europe. I have read a lot of posts but I have not found many that outline traveling success recommendations. While there is some entertaining in the mix it is not excessive I am more interested in how people manage a restrictive diet around the chaotic schedules of business travelers.
  • You may need to adjust your eating schedule to work around your travel, but the same rules should apply where feasible: No distracted eating, no snacking unless unavoidable, when you do eat choose Protein first, and stay hydrated.
• Last but not least. One of my bucket list items has long been to ride a bicycle across the country from coast to coast. Before I even contemplated the surgery I started making plans for when I might be able to do this and how I could go about making it happen. One of the big issues was certainly my weight which would be helped by the surgery. However, again with the diet restrictions and hydration needs I wonder if there are any challenges or problems with long endurance activities like this. Currently this would be a couple years post surgery so healing should be complete, my concern is are there problems with dehydration.
  • I haven't researched this particular topic, but several years out it seems like many have returned to a "normal" diet. Not back to overeating or eating poorly, but eating reasonable portions and drinking reasonable amounts of Water. In this regard, I imagine the risk of dehydration would be lessened so long as you aren't going all day without some form of nutrition or hydration.

You do seem to have a lot of mental obstacles to overcome. You could certainly benefit from additional therapy before and after surgery, possibly by a therapist experienced with food addiction.

[TboneGA 4]

On 4/15/2018 at 4:55 PM, newself said:

People always wonder why I'm overweight. I don't really eat fast food, but I ate all day long and my Snacks were not really snacks; they were the same calorie count as a "normal meal." My high weight was 240 over the years, I got it down 20 lbs repeatedly but it was incredibly hard and took months and months, only to rebound. This surgery was a last ditch effort to feel good in my skin, mentally and physically. I had to pay out of pocket because I did not have a co morbidity and a 34 bmi, so obviously this was not a life and death surgery for me.

That is my background. This is not an easy road, BUT it will teach you to slow down and eat much, much less food. No, you will not be able to pig out but you will be able to have a bite or two of your favorite foods and be satisfied. I am able to enjoy each bite without shoveling in as much as possible. At celebration events you will taste a little bit of various foods and not have that bulging full feeling that feels horrible. I know this is hard to believe, but I do not miss the gorging at the holidays. I feel a huge amount of pride and control over my body and choices.

I'm only 7.5 weeks out but I can say this is the best things I've ever done for myself! I've lost 26.8 lbs as of last week.

Like you I have never been a part of a forum or read any but, here is so much wisdom on these pages, and I have learned so much.

Thank you for the response this helps.

[Frustr8 7,886]

I think if I am invited to any holiday bashes and it's getting fewer because the older generation on both sides is dying off and my generation doesn't give a flip whether they come or not. That said I will put a small amount,on my plate, move it around a lot so it looks like I'm eating and engage in conversation more than actually chomping. One,of my other handicaps is I now have dentures. So hard raw vegetables are more I don't think so than an out-right no no. As to travel to other countries, no other country overloads their,plates like we Americans do, even my Canadian cousins are more prudent with their food selections. What looks tiny to our plumped out mindset may look perfectly logical to them. I married into a Dutch family, it took 2 generations before they came close to eating the amount we do . I was raised farmergirl style, we raised,it, we knew it was as chemical free as possible to take those mashed potatos, gravy and a couple thick slices of pork or beef. Load the rest of your plate with vegetables in real butter sauce. That was always there, we had cream and one of the little girl chores along,with gathering eggs was churning butter, be it a wooden or hand one, and yes I've used both, we weren't Amish just country Methodist. And if there was room left, there were homemade pies, cakes and Cookies for dessert. See why my fat cells got so,plump?
Biking, a good idea, start out with miniruns and build up to your cross country goal. And if you happen to visit my Dutch cousins-in- law, they may not feed you as heavy,but you can ride all over the Netherlands with them.
Hope you do meet all your goals.
As Bloody Mary says in South Pacific
You got to have a
dream
Cause if you don't have a
dream
How you gonna have a dream come true?
Smiles and hugs my friend!😝