VENTING - can vs should

[Joann454 1,329]

I've been involved in enough Facebook political posts to have developed very tough skin.
I have a lot of empathy but also a short fuse for stupidity. I don't see myself changing so more often than not I just won't respond to a post where someone is clearly attention seeking. People are weird. That's why I live on a farm in the country

[BigTexasMandy 60]

1 minute ago, Joann454 said:

I've been involved in enough Facebook political posts to have developed very tough skin.
I have a lot of empathy but also a short fuse for stupidity. I don't see myself changing so more often than not I just won't respond to a post where someone is clearly attention seeking. People are weird. That's why I live on a farm in the country

Haha, you're absolutely right! People are weird. I hope you're enjoying farm life!

[PatientEleventyBillion 851]

23 minutes ago, Mandy Vachon said:

And your reply won't change how people are either... did it feel productive what you said? Do you feel as if you changed me and my whininess? I believe this post stated this was a vent/rant... I wonder how calling my whiny will change my opinion or improve your life...

Whether or not it changed anything is moot .. you give your opinions.. I give mine. If you think you're the only one with the right of an opinion think again.

[Sosewsue61 3,185]

This is exactly what the OP is getting at - getting snarky, personal and combative in words and approach. And it happens on nearly every internet forum.

I have seen great threads and I have seen some threads that get abusive in nature. Everyone is allowed an opinion and to give their personal experience as an example. The consensus is that we all want the best outcome for people seeking advice.

When there is a huge discrepancy in dietary plans from the various bariatric teams, and even support and care, so if those posters come on here and read yet other variations from users, it is going to be hard to decipher the best options let alone manage the 'in-fighting' and tone.

[PatientEleventyBillion 851]

2 minutes ago, Sosewsue61 said:

This is exactly what the OP is getting at - getting snarky, personal and combative in words and approach. And it happens on nearly every internet forum.

I have seen great threads and I have seen some threads that get abusive in nature. Everyone is allowed an opinion and to give their personal experience as an example. The consensus is that we all want the best outcome for people seeking advice.

When there is a huge discrepancy in dietary plans from the various bariatric teams, and even support and care, so if those posters come on here and read yet other variations from users, it is going to be hard to decipher the best options let alone manage the 'in-fighting' and tone.

Well I mean, what is best all depends on the person anyways. We all have quirks when it comes to what we eat, what we can eat, along with our lifestyles.. so we all filter information according to how we personally want to do things.

The issue for this thread is more like this "safe space" mentality under the premise of tolerance, which is an oxymoron.

[Joann454 1,329]

Well I mean, what is best all depends on the person anyways. We all have quirks when it comes to what we eat, what we can eat, along with our lifestyles.. so we all filter information according to how we personally want to do things.
The issue for this thread is more like this "safe space" mentality under the premise of tolerance, which is an oxymoron.

I didn't take it as "safe space mentality" at all. There's blunt and to the point and there's rude. It should be easy to tell the difference and I don't think rude is terribly subjective. It's pretty clear. I sense a "snowflake" accusation next. Let's not go there on here. There's lots of places those terms can be slung around. Feels like you guys both made your point.

[DMac 12]

There is a Rants and Raves forum. This thread has zero Post Operation Surgical Questions value.

[BigTexasMandy 60]

1 hour ago, DMac said:

There is a Rants and Raves forum. This thread has zero Post Operation Surgical Questions value.

I am a new user and did not realize there was a place to rant. I posted under this topic because it's where I am at in my process... Is there a way to move a post?

Edited May 27, 2017 by Mandy Vachon

[blizair09 3,250]

Let's see -- what are some of my favorites? Swedish fish, peeps, pizza on day 3 post-op, chicken fingers and fries during the pre-op liquid diet, ice cream as a full liquid, putting Protein Powder in a milkshake, alcohol during the first month post-op, a pork chop in the first week post-op. And there have been countless others; these are just the ones I remember off the top of my head. (And most of these posts come in the form of yes/no questions -- can I eat swedish fish? -- can't ice-cream count as a liquids? -- etc.)

Yea, I have sparred with some folks in some of these threads -- mostly because I want better for people. But probably 1/2 to 3/4 of the people I've encountered on this site really aren't making lifestyle changes, aren't changing their relationship with food, and aren't going to be successful long-term because of their decisions and their inability to get a handle on food. And those people will be blowing up these forums for a while, and then they'll disappear until they come back months or maybe even years later talking about how WLS failed them and they need a revision to one thing or another. And then the cycle will repeat. For those people who are super focused on what they need to do to be successful pre- and post-op, this gets really frustrating. Yes, it's probably better to just ignore these kinds of posts, but, again, many folks just want better for these people, make a comment, and then commence the next internet war.

There are a handful of people on here who are successful and thoughtful. I stick around to see what they say. Everyone else can eat/drink/post/etc. whatever they want to. I'm just going to enjoy my 200 pound weight loss, and work on getting this last 17 pounds off by the end of the summer.

[MBird 298]

Sorry this is long....

The first thing I MUST address is the way in which some people talk to on another on WLS forums. Often, I will stumble upon a post because I Google a question looking for an answer in the moment rather than asking something that may have already been asked and waiting. I've noticed a lot of people being extremely critical of the questioner...

Here is an example (in a weak moment -MOMENT being the keyword - I might add... I'm on the liquid diet), I found someone asking if in the pure liquid post-surgery diet stage if they could have sugar free soft-serve ice cream. The first response was from someone who decided that rather than answer the question, they would provide an impromptu lecture on slider foods and how they should be dealing with food post-surgery. While I recognize posting on the internet opens you up to opportunities of criticism, I would hope that most people on weight-loss-surgery forums would have enough common sense to understand that most people on here are adults capable of choosing what they want to do. She didn't ask if she SHOULD eat the ice cream, she asked if she COULD eat it. I'm not saying the concern about slider foods wasn't without merit, but it wasn't warranted in this situation. Turns out, the poster just wanted to see if she could indulge in a lick or two in a social setting (a birthday party or something). She wasn't planning to enter a soft-serve eating contest. And even if she was... SO WHAT?! How does that impact the responder in any way? Why waste the time responding? The question wasn't, "What's an exmaple of a slider food and what are the dangers of a slider food?" UGH!

This leads me to another thing I'm really, really, really frustrated with. NOT EVERYONE HAS MENTAL ISSUES WITH FOOD THAT IS OVERWEIGHT OR UNDERWEIGHT OR IS INCAPABLE OF CHANGE OR INCAPABLE OF LEARNING WAYS TO COPE WITH FOOD ADDICTION. I am not saying it will be EASY, but it doesn't mean someone can't overcome their addiction. I know people from all ends of the spectrum who have accidentally overeaten at a holiday or party or have made a bad choice (food related or not) and I know many people who OBSESS over the food they put into their bodies and have done some serious emotional and physical damage by being TOO restrictive. Here's the point I am trying to make...

WHAT WORKS FOR YOU MAY NOT WORK FOR ANOTHER PERSON. And perhaps this is my unsound opinion, but having HAD WLS does not make you an EXPERT on WLS no matter how long ago you've gone; until you've gone to school and extensively studied psychology, gotten your doctorate, etc. etc. etc., no one wants to hear it unless they specifically ask you hey what SHOULD I do! SHOULD BEING THE KEY WORD!

Yes, some people may find it best avoid slider foods at all costs for the rest of their lives. However, other people will be able to indulge in a few bites of ice cream, or whatever and it doesn't undo all of their hard work or everything they've accomplished.

I have to say that I'm so disappointed when looking for answers to certain WLS-related questions to see so many people 1 - not answering the question directly, 2 - providing emotional/psychological advice, 3 - just not showing a little more compassion to people regardless of where they are in their journey, 4 - assuming you know anything about the person based on a question they've asked. And hey maybe you can tell they're making a huge mistake, but they may have worded the question incorrectly, they may be having a difficult time with something else in their life and they're searching for empathy from someone else who may have gone through something similar... the point is, a simple question doesn't provide you all the facts so stop assuming things about people because they've had weight loss surgery or are contemplating it!!!

On a related note, I'm so disappointed in the frequency in which I read people who start off by replying, "I'm sorry, but..." YOU ARE NOT SORRY! You are about to say something hurtful. If you have to say BUT after sorry, you're just not and you should delete your sentence and go read a book. Unless you're saying, "I'm sorry, but you're totally awesome and I love that you're realizing you're perfectly capable of realizing this is an internet forum and not a conversation with your doctor..." but rarely does it go that way.

FINALLY, I am so tired of reading things that are presented as black and white. I bet there are a bunch of people who disagree with what I have said... okay, fine, but does that mean I'm wrong? DISAGREEING WITH SOMEONE DOES NOT MAKE THEM WRONG AND IT DOESN'T MAKE YOU RIGHT. SOMETIMES YOU CAN BOTH BE RIGHT, WRONG, OR IN BETWEEN!

50 Shades of Grey? TRY A BILLION! AHHHH!

PS - I really need the pureed food stage to arrive... and fast.

I agree with you, and also understand we are all different. There are so many people who come in here and their doctors haven't provided them with much information at all, they ask a question such as the example you provided, and someone "criticizes" by telling them why they would be better off without it. I agree tact goes a long way in these discussions, but also feel we need to try and be honest for those who don't know, rather than allow bad information, untrue facts, or bad habits to rule the forums. Many people want to do the best they can with regard to their surgery.

My doctor, the NA and Nurse were amazed by my fast recovery in the hospital and wanted me to speak. One asked if I had seen the bariatric support groups and she was appalled regarding them. I explained I've seen it but try to be factual and kind at the same time. Some people just don't know. It's not always their fault, some don't even know where to start looking!

I feel when someone is pissy and snarky it does no good. Being factual in a compassionate and kind way does. It's a fine line to walk.

Also about addictions and head hunger, etc., etc. I find that people have gained weight and become addicted to food in a myriad of ways, others eat out of boredom and even happiness.

Some just eat because they love food - one thing is true though, something went wrong to compromise their health, me included, and finding out what it is is really the best weapon against gaining and repeating bad health. It's not wrong to point out when someone obviously has an issue, it's helpful. What they decide to do with that information is up to them, and one should always be kind when trying to confront someone about such a sensitive issue.

We cannot possibly understand the intent to which people are replying, I certainly do not know how sorry someone is or isn't when they try to be honest to the OP, I don't know the intent of the OP. Some people are not grammatically up to par either.

All I can do is share my little bit of knowledge -having a degree doesn't make someone the only one capable of sharing a fact that may help someone.

I can understand where you come from, completely. If we are just kinder to people, a little more validating of their emotional standpoint, we would probably quibble a lot less and misunderstand intent a bit less.

It's online though, so much gets lost in text, sadly.

[MBird 298]

I am a new user and did not realize there was a place to rant. I posted under this topic because it's where I am at in my process... Is there a way to move a post?

No way to move a post. You're ok.

[lindabalseca 373]

Sorry this is long....
The first thing I MUST address is the way in which some people talk to on another on WLS forums. Often, I will stumble upon a post because I Google a question looking for an answer in the moment rather than asking something that may have already been asked and waiting. I've noticed a lot of people being extremely critical of the questioner...
Here is an example (in a weak moment -MOMENT being the keyword - I might add... I'm on the liquid diet), I found someone asking if in the pure liquid post-surgery diet stage if they could have sugar free soft-serve ice cream. The first response was from someone who decided that rather than answer the question, they would provide an impromptu lecture on slider foods and how they should be dealing with food post-surgery. While I recognize posting on the internet opens you up to opportunities of criticism, I would hope that most people on weight-loss-surgery forums would have enough common sense to understand that most people on here are adults capable of choosing what they want to do. She didn't ask if she SHOULD eat the ice cream, she asked if she COULD eat it. I'm not saying the concern about slider foods wasn't without merit, but it wasn't warranted in this situation. Turns out, the poster just wanted to see if she could indulge in a lick or two in a social setting (a birthday party or something). She wasn't planning to enter a soft-serve eating contest. And even if she was... SO WHAT?! How does that impact the responder in any way? Why waste the time responding? The question wasn't, "What's an exmaple of a slider food and what are the dangers of a slider food?" UGH!
This leads me to another thing I'm really, really, really frustrated with. NOT EVERYONE HAS MENTAL ISSUES WITH FOOD THAT IS OVERWEIGHT OR UNDERWEIGHT OR IS INCAPABLE OF CHANGE OR INCAPABLE OF LEARNING WAYS TO COPE WITH FOOD ADDICTION. I am not saying it will be EASY, but it doesn't mean someone can't overcome their addiction. I know people from all ends of the spectrum who have accidentally overeaten at a holiday or party or have made a bad choice (food related or not) and I know many people who OBSESS over the food they put into their bodies and have done some serious emotional and physical damage by being TOO restrictive. Here's the point I am trying to make...
WHAT WORKS FOR YOU MAY NOT WORK FOR ANOTHER PERSON. And perhaps this is my unsound opinion, but having HAD WLS does not make you an EXPERT on WLS no matter how long ago you've gone; until you've gone to school and extensively studied psychology, gotten your doctorate, etc. etc. etc., no one wants to hear it unless they specifically ask you hey what SHOULD I do! SHOULD BEING THE KEY WORD!
Yes, some people may find it best avoid slider foods at all costs for the rest of their lives. However, other people will be able to indulge in a few bites of ice cream, or whatever and it doesn't undo all of their hard work or everything they've accomplished.
I have to say that I'm so disappointed when looking for answers to certain WLS-related questions to see so many people 1 - not answering the question directly, 2 - providing emotional/psychological advice, 3 - just not showing a little more compassion to people regardless of where they are in their journey, 4 - assuming you know anything about the person based on a question they've asked. And hey maybe you can tell they're making a huge mistake, but they may have worded the question incorrectly, they may be having a difficult time with something else in their life and they're searching for empathy from someone else who may have gone through something similar... the point is, a simple question doesn't provide you all the facts so stop assuming things about people because they've had weight loss surgery or are contemplating it!!!
On a related note, I'm so disappointed in the frequency in which I read people who start off by replying, "I'm sorry, but..." YOU ARE NOT SORRY! You are about to say something hurtful. If you have to say BUT after sorry, you're just not and you should delete your sentence and go read a book. Unless you're saying, "I'm sorry, but you're totally awesome and I love that you're realizing you're perfectly capable of realizing this is an internet forum and not a conversation with your doctor..." but rarely does it go that way.
FINALLY, I am so tired of reading things that are presented as black and white. I bet there are a bunch of people who disagree with what I have said... okay, fine, but does that mean I'm wrong? DISAGREEING WITH SOMEONE DOES NOT MAKE THEM WRONG AND IT DOESN'T MAKE YOU RIGHT. SOMETIMES YOU CAN BOTH BE RIGHT, WRONG, OR IN BETWEEN!
50 Shades of Grey? TRY A BILLION! AHHHH!
PS - I really need the pureed food stage to arrive... and fast.

Well said there are a few regular bashers that I cringe when I see there name...I scroll right past because I can't bare to read ho they are gonna degrade that person

[lindabalseca 373]

And your reply won't change how people are either... did it feel productive what you said? Do you feel as if you changed me and my whininess? I believe this post stated this was a vent/rant... I wonder how calling my whiny will change my opinion or improve your life...

Probably because they are miserable in theirs and making someone else feel bad is a temporary victory for them. Would they talk to their mother like that or a close friend...gosh I hope not but the more this goes on I think they would....

[Introversion 1,876]

2 hours ago, blizair09 said:

Let's see -- what are some of my favorites? Swedish fish, peeps, pizza on day 3 post-op, chicken fingers and fries during the pre-op liquid diet, ice cream as a full liquid, putting Protein Powder in a milkshake, alcohol during the first month post-op, a pork chop in the first week post-op.

Let's not forget about the one who ate an entire pizza at 3 weeks post-surgery. No one needs a fancy doctoral degree to conclude this person may have dire unresolved issues with his/her relationship with food. By the way, I steered clear of that thread.

Also, there's the woman who got sick eating a Big Mac at 4 days post-surgery. Again, common sense dictates that she may have unresolved food issues if she'd willingly risk her life fulfilling a Big Mac craving when she's supposed to be on nothing but full liquids.

These individuals visit online forums on the hunt for comments that validate their poor decisions, usually under the guise of "needing support" or "seeking advice." Any advice that follows the course of "You might develop a staple line leak by eating burgers and pizza at a few days post-op" is shouted down as rude.

Of course, these are often the folks who never make it to their goal weight or, if they do, they start to fiercely regain during the second year and beyond.

For a massive percentage of the weight loss surgery community, the biggest challenges are psychological in nature. After all, the surgeon operates on our stomachs and not our heads.

[Abeille213 59]

Let's not forget about the one who ate an entire pizza at 3 weeks post-surgery. No one needs a fancy doctoral degree to conclude this person may have dire unresolved issues with his/her relationship with food. By the way, I steered clear of that thread.
Also, there's the woman who got sick eating a Big Mac at 4 days post-surgery. Again, common sense dictates that she may have unresolved food issues if she'd willingly risk her life fulfilling a Big Mac craving when she's supposed to be on nothing but full liquids.
These individuals visit online forums on the hunt for comments that validate their poor decisions, usually under the guise of "needing support" or "seeking advice." Any advice that follows the course of "You might develop a staple line leak by eating burgers and pizza at a few days post-op" is shouted down as rude.
Of course, these are often the folks who never make it to their goal weight or, if they do, they start to fiercely regain during the second year and beyond.
For a massive percentage of the weight loss surgery community, the biggest challenges are psychological in nature. After all, the surgeon operates on our stomachs and not our heads.

Exactly as you said, for most of us the issue is psychological. That's what terrifies me so much. The surgery is an incredible tool, but it won't be fully successful without addressing the psychological aspect of things. That's something I have to really start facing. My surgery is coming up really soon. I need to find a therapist. I don't want to fail.


Transitioning from lapband to bypass on June 12!
HW: 402, CW: 314, GW 185