CrankyMagpie

If your team is cool with it, don't let me talk you out of it! You can always change it up if your labs come back short on something. ❤️

Whatever number I put on here is random. The number in my head is 165, but if I lose just an average amount, I'll be somewhere closer to 190. Which is fine. Life at 190 pounds is fine. BMI is bull💩, scientifically speaking, but 165 puts me at a lower BMI rating and, one assumes, better treatment by medical professionals (because they use BMI for every-dang-thing, despite what nonsense it is). So it's worth striving that extra little bit, to me, if I'm still feeling good when I hit Goal 1.

My team doesn't support their use, and I haven't seen any scientific evidence that they work. (I mean, I'm not saying "I don't use them and you shouldn't either," because some people on here do use them and, presumably, still have perfectly fine numbers when they do their blood tests. I'm just saying that I, personally, am uncomfortable with them, in part because my team is opposed to their use.)

You are going hard for carbs lately. Keep it up. I think that, in the future, we will look back on our current anti-carb obsession with the same derision as we look back on the anti-fat nonsense of the 1990s. It's a fad. It will pass. Nutrition science is in its infancy, and every single nutritionist I've ever met, and most I've followed online for any time, have been dogmatic. There are dogmatic vegetarian/vegan nutritionists, dogmatic anti-carb nutritionists (bariatric teams seem to hire them disproportionately often), dogmatic "three meals/no snacks" nutritionists, dogmatic "eat small amounts all day" nutritionists. More than one nutritionist I've had the misfortune to deal with has been entirely ignorant about the research surrounding BMR changes brought on by diet, probably because their paycheck required them to stay ignorant. They all (all of them I've met and nearly all of them whose websites I visit) cherry-pick their sources, ignoring the things they don't want to integrate into their practice. Nutrition "science," as practiced in client-facing situations, is just survivorship bias writ large. "Well this all works for ME." MEH! ... Hi, I'm CrankyMagpie, and I didn't know I had a rant waiting to get out, but here we are.

I'm now a little past two weeks out. I was allergic to something they used during the surgery, and I broke into hives all over my torso a week out. I'm still dealing with that, though I think maybe it's getting a little better now. My incisions are all looking good, no pain to speak of. I'm on soft/puree foods (my team doesn't make a distinction) and have worked my way through Greek yogurt, ricotta, cottage cheese, and refried beans. I'm a little afraid to make the jump to chicken, baked fish, or canned tuna. Or eggs--I don't "soft cook" eggs; I cook them all the way through, so I was planning to keep holding off on those for a bit. But I know once I get some kind of denser protein source in my daily life, I won't have to drink so many protein shakes. That's a pretty big enticement. Drinking enough liquid is only hard because I have to stop half an hour on either side of eating, and I'm still sleeping a lot. But I can drink normal (pre-op) amounts, per sip, as long as I don't actually gulp. I can walk a mile, if there are benches where I can stop and rest for a few seconds here and there. (I needed that pre-op, too, because of arthritis. My arthritis is less bad at the moment; now, I stop mostly because I'm still not supposed to be getting out of breath, and most of the places to walk around here have hills.)

Don't take any more Advil until after you've talked to your surgeon. I'm not supposed to take it for something like 3 months. Don't take Excedrin either. If your surgeon prescribed you some kind of pain med, that's OK, and Tylenol is OK, but those are your only safe options right now. Are you hydrated? Try getting more liquids in; that should help the headache.

I've definitely seen people say they don't eat fruit. Even in this thread, people seemed surprised that anyone might eat 3 whole servings of fruit in a day, like that is wild and mind-blowing. I probably will, some days, when I'm not so restricted? My throwing in beans might just be leftover annoyance at Paleo. I don't know if there are that many people who go out of their way to avoid beans, post-WLS. I hope not! They're amazing, nutritionally!

Ooh, which zombie novels? (If you don't mind saying.)

I'm mad at your family on your behalf 😡 I'm also still pretty tired (10/3). I have always needed more sleep than most people (9 hours a night, give or take), but I need even more than that, right now. I'm really paranoid about blood clots, so I'm setting an alarm to get up and drink a few sips and walk a few laps of my room ~5 hours after bedtime, if I haven't been up to use the restroom yet. That probably? isn't? helping? Nor is the Benadryl my surgeon has me on, probably--I'm getting a lower quality of sleep, I think. I'm very tired.

There's also an entire sub-forum: https://www.bariatricpal.com/forum/1101-vegetarian-or-vegan-eating/

It makes me sad to think there are people avoiding fruit and beans for the rest of their lives. I won't do that. (Heck, I'm two weeks post-op, and fat-free refried beans are the next puree/soft food on my list to try!) Both are a major part of the diets of some of the healthiest groups of people in the world. We know processed foods with simple carbohydrates are what make us (society as a whole) fat and unhealthy. Fruits come with fiber and vitamins packaged in, so they're pretty great. They're a lower priority than protein-containing foods (like beans), while we're severely restricted in what we can eat, but after that, they're great! I'm still treating 60 grams of protein as a minimum, and I'm still going to get some animal protein most days, but his "veggie first" approach seems like a good way to live, long-term.

Those of you whose families are being awful: you might consider having them read this article ("Everything You Know About Obesity is Wrong," by Michael Hobbes, published in the Huffington Post)

This is a rant, not a rave, and it's worth noting that I'm angrier than usual, right now, because the news (in the US) has me rubbed raw, and I don't imagine being on the pre-op liquid diet is exactly helping my mood. Anyway... I always have this very strong set of emotions for everyone in these forums whose partners aren't supportive. A little of it is that I'm impressed at their fortitude--I just wouldn't put up with some of the behavior I read about, and I admire their patience. (I don't think they should put up with most of those behaviors, to be clear; I'm just impressed that they can.) Some of it is bafflement, that they do put up with it and don't leave, or react negatively enough to prevent the behavior from recurring. Some of it is, you know, specific anger at the partners' lack of support, and some of it is just a deepening of this constant underlying feminist rage that so many of us have been feeling in recent years, because gender roles so often play such a huge part in all of this, and it's infuriating, in 2018, when we should all know better. (There are, on occasion, unsupportive wives, sure, absolutely. But that is not what the bulk of the stories we see here are. Please don't @ me with stories of unsupportive wives. All of this post applies to them, too, besides the part right before the parentheses.) We just see so much bad behavior. "This is extra hard because I have to cook for my partner and kids." Have to? "My partner keeps bringing my specific trigger food into the house after I've asked him not to. There are any number of snacks he'd enjoy as much, foods that wouldn't be problems for me, but he brings that." "My partner told me not to have the surgery, even though all of my doctors support it, even though I have educated him about the benefits and about how minimal the risks are, and even though insurance covers most of it." It makes me furious. And there isn't a thing I, or anyone else on these forums, can do about it. Encouraging people to leave their partners when they aren't ready to do so is rarely helpful. (And I do recognize we're only getting part of the story. Maybe not every single one of these people we hear about deserves a breakup/divorce, though a few of them... whew.) The kind of bad behavior we see some partners exhibiting is probably not a good indicator that they'd be up for couples' counseling, so there's not a ton of value in suggesting that. I guess we can encourage the person coming to us on the forums to seek their own therapy; that's how a lot of folks learn to set good boundaries and to see the patterns that are constructive, versus those that are destructive. But it's infuriating, right? Like, we can tell people how to change their own behavior, how to work around sabotage, but we know they're going to have this constant battle, for as long as their partner refuses to change--or to allow them to change, which is more the point. I guess, for my own part, I could do a better job of avoiding those threads. If I can't help (at least not much), then there's not a lot of sense in getting on that emotional rollercoaster in the first place. But now I know how widespread this is, and I'm ... just ... so ... angry!

Hey, just checking in (I read back through the thread to see how folks are doing. Thank you all for the well-wishes and condolences. ❤️ I just successfully ate my first cottage cheese since surgery (10/3), and I've done fine with Greek yogurt and ricotta (with just a little Italian seasoning and low-fat Trader Joe's pizza sauce, because that's what I have on hand). Balancing my nutritionists' "try to eat three meals per day" with "get more than 60 grams of protein" and "don't drink within half an hour of eating" and "get more than 64 ounces of liquid" is ... a lot, especially with going back to school and dealing with family stuff. I'm not getting all that much protein from my food, because I'm only eating a couple of tablespoons, maybe, per "meal." I know it gets easier, and if I'm only at 55 grams of protein one day (or, like ... three?) it won't kill me or make all of my hair fall out. I'm not freaked out about it, just sharing the struggle, I guess. My vitamins make me a little sick, though as the amount of food I can eat increases, so does my tolerance for them. It'll work itself out. Also, I joked to my spouse, before surgery: "I'm ready for all kinds of complications, so the one I end up with will be one I didn't think of." Yeah. Uh. I was allergic to something they used during the surgery. About a week afterward, I broke out in hives all over my torso and the tops of my thighs. My surgeon isn't very helpful: "try taking Benadryl, and if that doesn't work I'll order a steroid block for you, but I don't want to do that." (Steroids wreak havoc on post-surgical healing.) I've looked for information online, and most people get over them on their own, so I'm making due with hydrocortisone cream (it's a steroid, but only a low amount of it, and on my skin instead of being taken as a pill), Aveeno eczema-strength lotion (has a lot of oats in it, which are good for this kind of thing), and Benadryl at night. So... that's been awful. (They are very itchy hives. It's terrible.) I can drink pretty normally again, now. I don't have to have these itty-bitty sips. I think gulping would hurt, and I make sure not to do that, but normal-size mouthfuls feel good. So... that's what just under two weeks out looks like, for me.

This is the last time I'm posting this list, but if someone else wants to take over updating it, please feel free. I just lost a family member (my father's husband, after losing my father last year), and I've kind of got other things to focus on right now. Don't look for me on the boards for a while. Thanks for understanding. Oct 1: aapb79Gmail.com chicagogirl74 chuckwalsh clara1900 cw19147 irishgal21 JennieJuniper momofmjbm Red Alicia Vwlover0611 Yare_2018 Oct 2: bmatt418 cindy t Deanayeah jgirlnyc Lizzieming Marla522 nikoleroze Oct517 Oct 3: boringtessa CrankyMagpie Leahandthesleeve LosingLbs18 mamadownsizing sandebch sekud02 Oct 4: AriesMary25 btrfly kerbear1980 mspink702 rnchaveri1 salsalawyer sleevemebaby7781 swisskath Oct 5: greener pastures mommytina rafc100 Suesloosinit Oct 8: Crystalmartin82 jhojho90 Oct 9: Anglkrys2 bigcurt mailchickie76 SheilahMc Oct 10: busyforever fandangle MeeAhhh oct102018 spatch2813 Oct 11: aussie Ange healthygirl05 kathy060464 UncleBeezy willowfinely Oct 12: Tabularasa2018 zpratt Oct 14: katiemarie22 Oct 15: allyb15 annaisbananas April1965 JessLess llrn90 MegsNiko (or maybe the 17th?) recreating_courtney redaj954 Tina6769 Oct 16: 2shea beccaconaty87 br3n Georgetown Thisismytime ummyasmin Wincy Oct 17: Chello219 crystalml Fawksy Grapefruit Jlh2350 JustKeepSwimming OpsMatt Oct 18: shazz73 Snaver Oct 19: afer0841 Oct 20: Lucybear22 Oct 22: clb164 GizzlyKitten Kathy10/22 kimberlymi laceco marciamae3474 Oct 23: bgarner47 emccomis kdiddle31 llhill mimi tahoegirl96118 Oct 24: Beachladee3 GirlShrinking Lovingmyselfforever Susiern56 tuttlemomma Oct 25: AndreaK. kiwiangel23 teenyshell Oct 26: amanda-xo carebear38 shany1567 TropicalBeachDoll Oct 29: 1BigHeart JadineC jflower88 Kai91 kjallen nedawson1908 notmyname Rgiannos Oct 30: sleevegirl88 wishful.shrinking Oct 31: relaxrelaterelease Skodes

I have to inject myself with blood thinners once a day for a month. I'm only mad about it because the injections have to be in my stomach, which is very hard for me to do. (That's where my organs live! I don't want to!) It does get very bruised. But whatever, the bruises heal eventually. And everything else heals, too, with or without the blood thinner. My incisions are itching so much that I know they're mostly healed. The risk of deep vein thrombosis leading to pulmonary embolism is scary enough to keep me giving myself the shots and moving around every hour when I'm awake. I actually might be taking it further than necessary, because I set an alarm 5 hours after I go to bed, and I get up and walk around then, too. (It isn't helping me be less tired, but I'm one of those people who need 9+ hours of sleep a night, and I don't want to risk developing a clot because I sleep longer than the average person.)

YES!! Sort of. I don't think I have steri-strips. I have some kind of purple glue over the incisions. But it is itching (or the incisions themselves are?) so much. I know wounds itch at a certain point in the healing process, and I'm hoping that point is very short-lived, because it's driving me batty.

OK, maybe I phrased my question wrong. I know that Netflix still comes to my house, and I know that I can (eventually, at some point in the future, when I can eat food again) order healthier foods or make my own pizza-like thing and have a very similar experience. And I also know that the pizza wasn't the point; it was the tradition, the having-something-to-look-forward-to, the let's-treat-ourselves-to-something-we-like, and besides the pizza itself, nothing about that has to change, strictly speaking. It's really nice of you all to point that out, but that wasn't supposed to be the point of my question, sorry. Instead, I wonder: What if we took this opportunity and made a new, better tradition? What might that look like? I feel like lots of people have probably (re)discovered things they like to do with their significant other, or their friends, or whoever, that they didn't do before, and I'd love to steal those ideas. A night of Netflix now and then is cool, and we will definitely do that. But those sedentary habits are part of what I'm trying to break up, here, you know? @Bhageerah says "Please go enjoy the time with your husband, no matter what it is! Take a walk, go play bingo, lazer tag, or start working out together! I don't care just as long as the two of you are doing it together and enjoying each others company!!" - It's true, just choosing to do anything at all and make it a special occasion is pretty great! And those were some good ideas. Give me more ideas, friends! (Please and thanks!)

Off-topic, but every time this thread shows up, I think to myself "that is a LOT of throwing up, I hope she's OK."

or her

It's not even the carbs, though. I read a study, a while back (I can dig it up if anyone cares), that looked at liver sizes of people after low-carb very low calorie diets, versus standard very low calorie diets, and they were the same. That said, once you make the transition into ketosis, you have a lot less hunger to deal with. So I see the "no carbs" thing as a kindness, rather than a medical necessity.

I asked my surgeon's PA if they used catheters, and she said no. That's a perfectly reasonable question to ask your team, and it would put your mind at ease.