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How do you feel about a mosque at "Ground Zero"?

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Started by loserbob, Jul 20, 2010 6:54 AM
129 replies to this topic
129 replies to this topic

    sagreenia

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 11:48 AM

#21
I am not saying I think it should be placed there, I do not care where they put it, I only care that it is a real place of worship and promotes peace and support to those who attend.
I think all this negative attention works against us.
I am one who would attend a buddhist temple if anything.


Posted August 27, 2010 - 12:27 PM

#22
BJean and I usually agree on most things but we are going to differ on this issue, which is okay. That's what makes this country great. You're entitled to your own opinion.

I think that when the world trade center is rebuilt it is going to be an awesome tribute not only to those who died on 9/11 but to what America stands for. I think it is going to overshadow this mosque both literally and figuratively. I think it will say to the world: You can destroy our buildings but you can't destroy our freedom. We will rebuild and our nation will be stronger for it. So build your mosques, build your synagogues, build your churches and pitch your revival tents. That is who we are as America and nothing you do will diminish this.

There is also a mosque 4 blocks from ground zero and I don't think any of us heard about that one. Two blocks more makes all the difference?

Edited by Cleo's Mom, August 27, 2010 - 12:40 PM.



Posted August 27, 2010 - 12:45 PM

#23
Posted Image


Monday, Aug 16, 2010 07:01 ET How the "ground zero mosque" fear mongering began

A viciously anti-Muslim blogger, the New York Post and the right-wing media machine: How it all went down Video

By Justin Elliott

AP
Blogger Pamela Geller and Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf

A group of progressive Muslim-Americans plans to build an Islamic community center two and a half blocks from ground zero in lower Manhattan. They have had a mosque in the same neighborhood for many years. There's another mosque two blocks away from the site. City officials support the project. Muslims have been praying at the Pentagon, the other building hit on Sept. 11, for many years.
In short, there is no good reason that the Cordoba House project should have been a major national news story, let alone controversy. And yet it has become just that, dominating the political conversation for weeks and prompting such a backlash that, according to a new poll, nearly 7 in 10 Americans now say they oppose the project. How did the Cordoba House become so toxic, so fast?
In a story last week, the New York Times, which framed the project in a largely positive, noncontroversial light last December, argued that it was cursed from the start by "public relations missteps." But this isn't accurate. To a remarkable extent, a Salon review of the origins of the story found, the controversy was kicked up and driven by Pamela Geller, a right-wing, viciously anti-Muslim, conspiracy-mongering blogger, whose sinister portrayal of the project was embraced by Rupert Murdoch's New York Post.
Here's a timeline of how it all happened:

  • Dec. 8, 2009: The Times publishes a lengthy front-page look at the Cordoba project. "We want to push back against the extremists," Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the lead organizer, is quoted as saying. Two Jewish leaders and two city officials, including the mayor's office, say they support the idea, as does the mother of a man killed on 9/11. An FBI spokesman says the imam has worked with the bureau. Besides a few third-tier right-wing blogs, including Pamela Geller's Atlas Shrugs site, no one much notices the Times story.
  • Dec. 21, 2009: Conservative media personality Laura Ingraham interviews Abdul Rauf's wife, Daisy Khan, while guest-hosting "The O'Reilly Factor" on Fox. In hindsight, the segment is remarkable for its cordiality. "I can't find many people who really have a problem with it," Ingraham says of the Cordoba project, adding at the end of the interview, "I like what you're trying to do."
  • (This segment also includes onscreen the first use that we've seen of the misnomer "ground zero mosque.") After the segment — and despite the front-page Times story — there were no news articles on the mosque for five and a half months, according to a search of the Nexis newspaper archive.
  • May 6, 2010: After a unanimous vote by a New York City community board committee to approve the project, the AP runs a story. It quotes relatives of 9/11 victims (called by the reporter), who offer differing opinions. The New York Post, meanwhile, runs a story under the inaccurate headline, "Panel Approves 'WTC' Mosque." Geller is less subtle, titling her post that day, "Monster Mosque Pushes Ahead in Shadow of World Trade Center Islamic Death and Destruction." She writes on her Atlas Shrugs blog, "This is Islamic domination and expansionism. The location is no accident. Just as Al-Aqsa was built on top of the Temple in Jerusalem." (To get an idea of where Geller is coming from, she once suggested that Malcolm X was Obama's real father. Seriously.)
  • May 7, 2010: Geller's group, Stop Islamization of America (SIOA), launches "Campaign Offensive: Stop the 911 Mosque!" (SIOA 's associate director is Robert Spencer, who makes his living writing and speaking about the evils of Islam.) Geller posts the names and contact information for the mayor and members of the community board, encouraging people to write. The board chair later reports getting "hundreds and hundreds" of calls and e-mails from around the world.
  • May 8, 2010: Geller announces SIOA's first protest against what she calls the "911 monster mosque" for May 29. She and Spencer and several other members of the professional anti-Islam industry will attend. (She also says that the protest will mark the dark day of "May 29, 1453, [when] the Ottoman forces led by the Sultan Mehmet II broke through the Byzantine defenses against the Muslim siege of Constantinople." The outrage-peddling New York Post columnist Andrea Peyser argues in a note at the end of her column a couple of days later that "there are better places to put a mosque."
  • May 13, 2010: Peyser follows up with an entire column devoted to "Mosque Madness at Ground Zero." This is a significant moment in the development of the "ground zero mosque" narrative: It's the first newspaper article that frames the project as inherently wrong and suspect, in the way that Geller has been framing it for months. Peyser in fact quotes Geller at length and promotes the anti-mosque protest of Stop Islamization of America, which Peyser describes as a "human-rights group." Peyser also reports — falsely — that Cordoba House's opening date will be Sept. 11, 2011.
Lots of opinion makers on the right read the Post, so it's not surprising that, starting that very day, the mosque story spread through the conservative — and then mainstream — media like fire through dry grass. Geller appeared on Sean Hannity's radio show. The Washington Examiner ran an outraged column about honoring the 9/11 dead. So did Investor's Business Daily. Smelling blood, the Post assigned news reporters to cover the ins and outs of the Cordoba House development daily. Fox News, the Post's television sibling, went all out.
Within a month, Rudy Giuliani had called the mosque a "desecration." Within another month, Sarah Palin had tweeted her famous "peaceful Muslims, pls refudiate" tweet. Peter King and Newt Gingrich and Tim Pawlenty followed suit — with political reporters and television news programs dutifully covering "both sides" of the controversy.
Geller had succeeded beyond her wildest dreams.

We have allowed one or two right wing extremists to affect groups and people in this country - first that guy who shut down ACORN with his edited videos (and who later posed as a telephone repairman to get into a democratic congressman's office to apparently bug the phones and was arrested), that Breitbart guy who edited Shirley Sherrod's video and now we have this woman pushing this issue.

I will not be duped by these people or sucked into their extremist right wing political agenda.

Edited by Cleo's Mom, August 27, 2010 - 12:53 PM.



    loserbob

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 12:52 PM

#24

I am not saying I think it should be placed there, I do not care where they put it, I only care that it is a real place of worship and promotes peace and support to those who attend.
I think all this negative attention works against us.
I am one who would attend a buddhist temple if anything.



If your saying "I only care that its a real place of worship", that means there is doubt in your mind. Why wont anyone say who's financing it? One of the main reasons I dont agree with putting one there is because I have my doubts and Im not willing to find out after its too late! Hows the saying go? You know the one Bush made popular by screwing it up, Fool me once etc!


    loserbob

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 12:59 PM

#25

Posted Image


Monday, Aug 16, 2010 07:01 ET How the "ground zero mosque" fear mongering began

A viciously anti-Muslim blogger, the New York Post and the right-wing media machine: How it all went down Video

By Justin Elliott

AP
Blogger Pamela Geller and Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf

A group of progressive Muslim-Americans plans to build an Islamic community center two and a half blocks from ground zero in lower Manhattan. They have had a mosque in the same neighborhood for many years. There's another mosque two blocks away from the site. City officials support the project. Muslims have been praying at the Pentagon, the other building hit on Sept. 11, for many years.
In short, there is no good reason that the Cordoba House project should have been a major national news story, let alone controversy. And yet it has become just that, dominating the political conversation for weeks and prompting such a backlash that, according to a new poll, nearly 7 in 10 Americans now say they oppose the project. How did the Cordoba House become so toxic, so fast?
In a story last week, the New York Times, which framed the project in a largely positive, noncontroversial light last December, argued that it was cursed from the start by "public relations missteps." But this isn't accurate. To a remarkable extent, a Salon review of the origins of the story found, the controversy was kicked up and driven by Pamela Geller, a right-wing, viciously anti-Muslim, conspiracy-mongering blogger, whose sinister portrayal of the project was embraced by Rupert Murdoch's New York Post.
Here's a timeline of how it all happened:

  • Dec. 8, 2009: The Times publishes a lengthy front-page look at the Cordoba project. "We want to push back against the extremists," Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the lead organizer, is quoted as saying. Two Jewish leaders and two city officials, including the mayor's office, say they support the idea, as does the mother of a man killed on 9/11. An FBI spokesman says the imam has worked with the bureau. Besides a few third-tier right-wing blogs, including Pamela Geller's Atlas Shrugs site, no one much notices the Times story.
  • Dec. 21, 2009: Conservative media personality Laura Ingraham interviews Abdul Rauf's wife, Daisy Khan, while guest-hosting "The O'Reilly Factor" on Fox. In hindsight, the segment is remarkable for its cordiality. "I can't find many people who really have a problem with it," Ingraham says of the Cordoba project, adding at the end of the interview, "I like what you're trying to do."
  • (This segment also includes onscreen the first use that we've seen of the misnomer "ground zero mosque.") After the segment — and despite the front-page Times story — there were no news articles on the mosque for five and a half months, according to a search of the Nexis newspaper archive.
  • May 6, 2010: After a unanimous vote by a New York City community board committee to approve the project, the AP runs a story. It quotes relatives of 9/11 victims (called by the reporter), who offer differing opinions. The New York Post, meanwhile, runs a story under the inaccurate headline, "Panel Approves 'WTC' Mosque." Geller is less subtle, titling her post that day, "Monster Mosque Pushes Ahead in Shadow of World Trade Center Islamic Death and Destruction." She writes on her Atlas Shrugs blog, "This is Islamic domination and expansionism. The location is no accident. Just as Al-Aqsa was built on top of the Temple in Jerusalem." (To get an idea of where Geller is coming from, she once suggested that Malcolm X was Obama's real father. Seriously.)
  • May 7, 2010: Geller's group, Stop Islamization of America (SIOA), launches "Campaign Offensive: Stop the 911 Mosque!" (SIOA 's associate director is Robert Spencer, who makes his living writing and speaking about the evils of Islam.) Geller posts the names and contact information for the mayor and members of the community board, encouraging people to write. The board chair later reports getting "hundreds and hundreds" of calls and e-mails from around the world.
  • May 8, 2010: Geller announces SIOA's first protest against what she calls the "911 monster mosque" for May 29. She and Spencer and several other members of the professional anti-Islam industry will attend. (She also says that the protest will mark the dark day of "May 29, 1453, [when] the Ottoman forces led by the Sultan Mehmet II broke through the Byzantine defenses against the Muslim siege of Constantinople." The outrage-peddling New York Post columnist Andrea Peyser argues in a note at the end of her column a couple of days later that "there are better places to put a mosque."
  • May 13, 2010: Peyser follows up with an entire column devoted to "Mosque Madness at Ground Zero." This is a significant moment in the development of the "ground zero mosque" narrative: It's the first newspaper article that frames the project as inherently wrong and suspect, in the way that Geller has been framing it for months. Peyser in fact quotes Geller at length and promotes the anti-mosque protest of Stop Islamization of America, which Peyser describes as a "human-rights group." Peyser also reports — falsely — that Cordoba House's opening date will be Sept. 11, 2011.
Lots of opinion makers on the right read the Post, so it's not surprising that, starting that very day, the mosque story spread through the conservative — and then mainstream — media like fire through dry grass. Geller appeared on Sean Hannity's radio show. The Washington Examiner ran an outraged column about honoring the 9/11 dead. So did Investor's Business Daily. Smelling blood, the Post assigned news reporters to cover the ins and outs of the Cordoba House development daily. Fox News, the Post's television sibling, went all out.
Within a month, Rudy Giuliani had called the mosque a "desecration." Within another month, Sarah Palin had tweeted her famous "peaceful Muslims, pls refudiate" tweet. Peter King and Newt Gingrich and Tim Pawlenty followed suit — with political reporters and television news programs dutifully covering "both sides" of the controversy.
Geller had succeeded beyond her wildest dreams.




Im not trying to lessen the Pentagon or Shanksville by any means but I think the World Trade Center is the place everyone thinks of when they remember 9-11. Like Bjean said, the towers where a symbol of economic dominance. Not to change the subject but I just found out I live 1 street over from a girl killed on the Lockerby bombing Airplane.


    loserbob

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 1:03 PM

#26

Posted Image


Monday, Aug 16, 2010 07:01 ET How the "ground zero mosque" fear mongering began

A viciously anti-Muslim blogger, the New York Post and the right-wing media machine: How it all went down Video

By Justin Elliott

AP
Blogger Pamela Geller and Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf

A group of progressive Muslim-Americans plans to build an Islamic community center two and a half blocks from ground zero in lower Manhattan. They have had a mosque in the same neighborhood for many years. There's another mosque two blocks away from the site. City officials support the project. Muslims have been praying at the Pentagon, the other building hit on Sept. 11, for many years.
In short, there is no good reason that the Cordoba House project should have been a major national news story, let alone controversy. And yet it has become just that, dominating the political conversation for weeks and prompting such a backlash that, according to a new poll, nearly 7 in 10 Americans now say they oppose the project. How did the Cordoba House become so toxic, so fast?
In a story last week, the New York Times, which framed the project in a largely positive, noncontroversial light last December, argued that it was cursed from the start by "public relations missteps." But this isn't accurate. To a remarkable extent, a Salon review of the origins of the story found, the controversy was kicked up and driven by Pamela Geller, a right-wing, viciously anti-Muslim, conspiracy-mongering blogger, whose sinister portrayal of the project was embraced by Rupert Murdoch's New York Post.
Here's a timeline of how it all happened:

  • Dec. 8, 2009: The Times publishes a lengthy front-page look at the Cordoba project. "We want to push back against the extremists," Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the lead organizer, is quoted as saying. Two Jewish leaders and two city officials, including the mayor's office, say they support the idea, as does the mother of a man killed on 9/11. An FBI spokesman says the imam has worked with the bureau. Besides a few third-tier right-wing blogs, including Pamela Geller's Atlas Shrugs site, no one much notices the Times story.
  • Dec. 21, 2009: Conservative media personality Laura Ingraham interviews Abdul Rauf's wife, Daisy Khan, while guest-hosting "The O'Reilly Factor" on Fox. In hindsight, the segment is remarkable for its cordiality. "I can't find many people who really have a problem with it," Ingraham says of the Cordoba project, adding at the end of the interview, "I like what you're trying to do."
  • (This segment also includes onscreen the first use that we've seen of the misnomer "ground zero mosque.") After the segment — and despite the front-page Times story — there were no news articles on the mosque for five and a half months, according to a search of the Nexis newspaper archive.
  • May 6, 2010: After a unanimous vote by a New York City community board committee to approve the project, the AP runs a story. It quotes relatives of 9/11 victims (called by the reporter), who offer differing opinions. The New York Post, meanwhile, runs a story under the inaccurate headline, "Panel Approves 'WTC' Mosque." Geller is less subtle, titling her post that day, "Monster Mosque Pushes Ahead in Shadow of World Trade Center Islamic Death and Destruction." She writes on her Atlas Shrugs blog, "This is Islamic domination and expansionism. The location is no accident. Just as Al-Aqsa was built on top of the Temple in Jerusalem." (To get an idea of where Geller is coming from, she once suggested that Malcolm X was Obama's real father. Seriously.)
  • May 7, 2010: Geller's group, Stop Islamization of America (SIOA), launches "Campaign Offensive: Stop the 911 Mosque!" (SIOA 's associate director is Robert Spencer, who makes his living writing and speaking about the evils of Islam.) Geller posts the names and contact information for the mayor and members of the community board, encouraging people to write. The board chair later reports getting "hundreds and hundreds" of calls and e-mails from around the world.
  • May 8, 2010: Geller announces SIOA's first protest against what she calls the "911 monster mosque" for May 29. She and Spencer and several other members of the professional anti-Islam industry will attend. (She also says that the protest will mark the dark day of "May 29, 1453, [when] the Ottoman forces led by the Sultan Mehmet II broke through the Byzantine defenses against the Muslim siege of Constantinople." The outrage-peddling New York Post columnist Andrea Peyser argues in a note at the end of her column a couple of days later that "there are better places to put a mosque."
  • May 13, 2010: Peyser follows up with an entire column devoted to "Mosque Madness at Ground Zero." This is a significant moment in the development of the "ground zero mosque" narrative: It's the first newspaper article that frames the project as inherently wrong and suspect, in the way that Geller has been framing it for months. Peyser in fact quotes Geller at length and promotes the anti-mosque protest of Stop Islamization of America, which Peyser describes as a "human-rights group." Peyser also reports — falsely — that Cordoba House's opening date will be Sept. 11, 2011.
Lots of opinion makers on the right read the Post, so it's not surprising that, starting that very day, the mosque story spread through the conservative — and then mainstream — media like fire through dry grass. Geller appeared on Sean Hannity's radio show. The Washington Examiner ran an outraged column about honoring the 9/11 dead. So did Investor's Business Daily. Smelling blood, the Post assigned news reporters to cover the ins and outs of the Cordoba House development daily. Fox News, the Post's television sibling, went all out.
Within a month, Rudy Giuliani had called the mosque a "desecration." Within another month, Sarah Palin had tweeted her famous "peaceful Muslims, pls refudiate" tweet. Peter King and Newt Gingrich and Tim Pawlenty followed suit — with political reporters and television news programs dutifully covering "both sides" of the controversy.
Geller had succeeded beyond her wildest dreams.

We have allowed one or two right wing extremists to affect groups and people in this country - first that guy who shut down ACORN with his edited videos (and who later posed as a telephone repairman to get into a democratic congressman's office to apparently bug the phones and was arrested), that Breitbart guy who edited Shirley Sherrod's video and now we have this woman pushing this issue.

I will not be duped by these people or sucked into their extremist right wing political agenda.



I believe if Pam Geller didnt start this someone else would have. Like I said before, theres a reason this is such a hot topic. The majority dont want it so it will never be.


    Murpel

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 1:16 PM

#27
My two cents worth...
#1, read the Koran. Anyone who isn't Muslim is an infidel and must be converted or "killed".
#2, There are reports that minorities in European countries are the indigenous population, who are now behind Muslims in their own country. (I don't remember which reporting agencies, sorry)
#3, the churches and synagogues close to Ground Zero were there Pre 9-11.
Final words from me....
While freedom from persecution (not religion) was the reason for our founding fathers to come to America, our founding fathers rightly tried to keep us safe from infestations of "non" right thinking persons. Yes, they too thought of our current situation. (Pretty smart dudes) While all men are created equal, they must act in accordance with the laws and rule of the land declaring them equal. If they are in MY country illegally... can't speak MY country's language, won't work and continuously breed (which currently gives them the right to stay here, even illegally)... They need to be deported. I don't really care where they go. They knew when they came here, they were here illegally... I don't feel sorry for them one bit. A little cold? Consider the lack of jobs for my children and grandchildren (or yours) that these "illegals and non English speaking" people have taken, to support their population booms. Not to mention the taxes "we" pay so they can stay here and breed!
Now they are trying to rub our faces in their "religion" at Ground Zero?
Not!
More than two cents worth, but I'm done.

Edited by Murpel, August 27, 2010 - 1:22 PM.



    loserbob

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 1:24 PM

#28
Heres my main problem. I know in past posts Ive said some awful things and thats not really how I feel. It was to get a rise out of people, which it did! Ok, heres the problem. There are alot of Muslims who live in this country and are upstanding citizens. Its not right to do things like what happened to the taxi driver(I actually think they should hang the guy who did it by his "you know whats" with piano string!!!!) But on the other hand, we're told to be tolerant and we find out the Muslim working at the kiosk at the mall is supporting Alqaeda or Hizbullah. I think if they want us to be tolerant they should go out of there way to make me believe. Keeping to themselves like most do wont work! Thats why Im thinking about going to the University of Pittsburgh, theyre having a Ramadan celebration until its over. Theres a 200 person tent set up and its open to the public so we can see , "learn" about Turkish culture. If you want me to learn about your Muslim culture, include food and Im there! Dont build a mosque where Muslim extremists killed 3000 people! There are Imams, Sheiks and Grand Muftys there. The writer of the story in the local paper said he attended and he felt very comfortable. The Imam I believe invited the writers family over to his house one evening this week to break fast for Ramadan.


    BJean

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 5:15 PM

#29
Well see, I'm getting educated about this topic. That's why I come here. I had only heard the fire that erupted about building a mosque where the World Trade Center was. Now that I've heard that Rupert Murdoch is behind it (it's nearly always his big money machine that causes fear and hate in America over political non-issues) and come to find out it isn't even on the site of the WTC, I'm calming down on the issue.

Do you all know who Rupert Murdoch is? Are you aware of his background and everything he owns in the U.S.?

Good thing we have Cleo'sMom here to bring the real story to light. And Cleo's you could have also listed the Kerry persecution that wrecked his campaign for president that was backed by the same kind of right wing extremism and money.

I should have known what was going on but I frankly do not watch a lot of Faux news broadcasts or even the other ones. So I usually only get bits and pieces of the story. When I am confused on an issue or dismayed by something I've read or heard, I usually check it out for myself. This time I didn't. And I'm really glad that this topic came up on this thread and I had an opportunity to learn more.


    loserbob

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Posted August 27, 2010 - 5:36 PM

#30

Well see, I'm getting educated about this topic. That's why I come here. I had only heard the fire that erupted about building a mosque where the World Trade Center was. Now that I've heard that Rupert Murdoch is behind it (it's nearly always his big money machine that causes fear and hate in America over political non-issues) and come to find out it isn't even on the site of the WTC, I'm calming down on the issue.

Do you all know who Rupert Murdoch is? Are you aware of his background and everything he owns in the U.S.?

Good thing we have Cleo'sMom here to bring the real story to light. And Cleo's you could have also listed the Kerry persecution that wrecked his campaign for president that was backed by the same kind of right wing extremism and money.

I should have known what was going on but I frankly do not watch a lot of Faux news broadcasts or even the other ones. So I usually only get bits and pieces of the story. When I am confused on an issue or dismayed by something I've read or heard, I usually check it out for myself. This time I didn't. And I'm really glad that this topic came up on this thread and I had an opportunity to learn more.



Bjean not so fast please. Rupert is associated with reps, I understand all that but there are also dems who support it. Also this building is a part of ground zero it was damaged by the landing gear of one of the planes! I read what CM posted up above and it did get me thinkin but this just isnt right! Like I said, it was bad enough they wanted to rebuild there but when they see the outpouring of anger and hurt its causing they still want to do it even after they where asked to move it with the help/money from the gov or state or someone! They where offered assistance and refused it! Thats not how you make friends. I know what CM and others are saying and its true, they have the right legally and a whole group is being persecuted for a few "bad apples" but the majority in this country feel as I do!

Edited by loserbob, August 27, 2010 - 5:40 PM.



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